Friday, March 13, 2015

All material bodies originate from the dreams of Maha-Visnu, while all jiva-souls originate from Goloka-Vrindavana and Vaikuntha (the spiritual worlds) No jiva-souls originate from Maha-Visnu but instead take shelter of Him after leaving the spiritual world.

Material bodily vessels come from the dreams of Maha-Visnu and are therefore a permanent fixture or 'post' in the mahat-tattva, or the material energy's roadway  of "past, present and future" that is traversed by an unlimited number of jiva-souls.

Maha-Visnu's dreams are eternal and exist above the material energies movement of material time, therefore His "dreams" are always available for "hire" by the visiting jiva-souls from Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana who choose to enter the material creation.

Srila Prabhupada - "When the jiva-souls enters the material world, they must "hire" a suitable material body off Maha-Visnu." (Lecture on BG New York City 1966)

Everything in the material creation is owned by Maha-Visnu and the visiting jiva-souls receive their material bodily vessels and fascilities from Him. 

After all, all material vessels belong to Maha-Visnu and the jiva-souls experience His dreams that are simultaneously in sync with the jiva-soul's desires.

In the material creation these jiva-souls are known as nitya-baddha, meaning they are eternally conditioned under the influence of material energy or Maya and are now covered by a temporary material bodily vessel.

And in the spiritual worlds of Goloka-Vrindavana and Vaikuntha the jiva-souls are known as nitya-siddha or fully Krsna conscious.

Free will allows the individual jiva-souls to choose to be either nitya-baddha (eternally conditioned) or nitya-siddha (eternally liberated)

Srila Prabhupada - "The actual constitutional position of every marginal living entity (jiva-soul) is nitya-siddha." (CC, July 13, 1976)

Srila Prabhupada - ''By following the rules and regulations and instructions of the spiritual master, he can also become siddha. He can become AGAIN nitya-siddha. So the Krsna consciousness movement is to make the nitya-baddhas AGAIN nitya-siddha, to bring them back home. It is a difficult task.'' (New York lecture on CC, July 13, 1976)

In this way the dreams of Maha-Visnu are a permanent back drop to the mahat-tattva or material energy's past, present and future. 

Srila Prabhupada  - "Arjuna can see everything that exists in any part of the universe. Kṛṣṇa gives him the power to see anything he wants to see, "past, present and future". Thus by the mercy of Kṛṣṇa, Arjuna is able to see everything." (BG 11.7 purport)

How past, present and future exist simultaneously as a blue-print (which means an entire roadway from beginning, middle and end) within the dreams of Maha-Visnu.

Bhagavad-gītā Ch 11 text 7-

"O Arjuna, whatever you wish to see, behold at once in this body of Mine! This universal form can show you whatever you now desire to see and whatever you may want to see in the future. Everything — moving and nonmoving — is here completely, in one place."

Srila Prabhupada - "No one can see the entire universe while sitting in one place. Even the most advanced scientist cannot see what is going on in other parts of the universe. But a devotee like Arjuna can see everything that exists in any part of the universe. Kṛṣṇa gives him the power to see anything he wants to see, past, present and future. Thus by the mercy of Kṛṣṇa, Arjuna is able to see everything." (BG Ch 11 text 7)

There is still a lot more to learn about the movement of the marginal living entities (jiva-souls), we have only scratched the surface in understanding Vedic texts in the short 55 years since Srila Prabhupada made his valuable contribution to the Western World in 1965.

The movement of time is eternal while this temporary material universe exists.

Yes, it's a paradox because everything is in a state of decay or decomposition in the material creation under the movement of material time's past, present and future but has no effect on Maha-Visnu.

In other words, Maha-Visnu's "dreams" are separate (and above) the material decaying influence of time (past, present and future), therefore His dreams are a permanent roadway "above" the temporary decomposing influence of the material energies movement of space and time.

Only when Maha-Visnu's dreams are activated within the material  creation, by the movement of past, present and future, does the temporary decaying nature of the material creation start on the bodily vessels and its surroundings that came from Maha-Visnu's library of dreams.

All material bodily vessels or containers are part and parcel of material time and space, a permanent fixture within Maha-Visnu's dreams.

However, only when the jiva-soul chooses to enter a material body from Maha-Visnu's dreams, and become the passengers in those material bodies within the material energy, does the temporary decaying effect on the material bodily vessels begin.

This is because now a dreams from Maha-Visnu has been actived by a jiva-soul and placed under the movement of material time or past, present and future which means impermanence and a progression of decomposition.

This is how entering the material  creation works. 

As soon as the jiva-soul enters a material body from Maha-Visnu's dreams immediately the temporary decaying aspect of that material body it activated, but only AFTER being "hired" from Maha-Visnu's "library of dreams."

The individual living entities or jiva-souls exists restricted to a material bodily vessel given to them by Maha-Visnu according to their independent desires and the reactions (karma) to past pious and impious activity in a previous material human bodies.

Past, present and future in the material creation exist simultaneously? How this occurs is explained above.

Because of the independent desires of the individual marginal living entity (jiva-soul), they can stay in the material creations cycle of repeated birth and death for an almost eternity.

In fact they can stay for so long that the arrangement of material energy in the material creation would eventually repeat itself over and over again over that eternity.

This is simple to understand, over an eternity the combinations of material energy would be exhausted until again it begins repeating itself, actually this is what "eternity" does.

There is no harm in philosophical speculation as long as we do not deviate from sastra, how else are we to learn?

Many have asked, "could the past activities of Arjuna still be happening today somewhere in the universe with another jiva-soul playing that part?"

Due to the past, present and future happening simultaneously, well could his bodily vessel also be a 'post' like Brahmas?

Meaning only those individual marginal living entities or jiva-souls who are qualified can also experience that relationship with Kṛṣṇa while in that vessel playing the part of Arjuna.

If this is true, the material bodily vessels are a permanent pathway or roadway the visiting jiva-soul chooses to go down experiencing its beginning, middle and end under the movement of material time's past, present and future.

Therefore unlimited batches of individual jiva-souls can choose the same permanent roadway too and possess that material bodily vessel from the dreams of Maha-Visnu.

There is no repetition or reoccurrence of the material universe there is only the permanent roadways (material bodily vessels) "hired" from Maha-Visnu so the jiva-souls can enter into.

Unlike the material energy, the spiritual energy is made up of Krsna's variety of individual living entities or expansions known as Visnu-tattva, Siva-tattva and jiva-tattva.  

The jiva-souls or jiva-tattva living entities have 78.125% of Krsna's qualities having 50 of Krsna's 64 attributes and have their independence and free will that allows them to have their own personality separate from Krsna's Personality.  

The Visnu-tattva more direct expansions of Krsna and almost no different as God have 93.75% of Krsna's qualities having 60 of Krsna's 64 attributes.  

Then there is Siva-tattva who is in a league of his own in between Visnu-tattva and jiva-tattva having 84.375% of Krsna's qualities having 55 of Krsna's 64 attributes.

Therefore unlike the material energy that is all one energy in its original state, the spiritual energy is NOT all one, it is made up of a variety of individual living entities as a spiritual bodily  form that includes the jiva-souls.  

Krsna is the Supreme individual Person as a spiritual bodily form with 2 arms, two legs etc as His eternal appearance.

All marginal living entities (jiva-souls) in their original position (bodily form), are also in Krsna's image Srila Prabhupāda explains here.

Devotee – "Is the original body of the spirit soul a human form?"

Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, human form. God is also human form. "Man is made after the shape of God." I think there is in the Bible. Is it not? So God is also like human form. Here you see Krsna, two hands, two legs."

Hari-sauri – "How do we understand, then, that there are peacocks and flowers and trees in the spiritual world? Are these not eternal forms?"

Srila Prabhupada – "[describing material form first]: Yes, they are more covered. Just like if you cover your body with blanket, the hands and legs are invisible. But you are not the blanket. So the trees and plants, they are more covered. They are not in full manifestation. The human form is the full manifestation of the soul."

Hari-sauri - "They are covered in the spiritual world?"

Srila Prabhupada - "Not in the spiritual world. There that is voluntary. Some devotees want to serve Krsna as flower; so they become flower there. If I want that, to be a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna and become flower, voluntarily, and he can change from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (SB 6.1.1-4, Melb, May 20, 1975)

The material energy makes up all the material bodily shells, vessels or containers that the jiva-souls are in, are all one, but NOT the jiva-souls who are eternally individual life forms. 

For example when the material body we are in wears out and decays, it breaks down and merges back into the "oneness of material energy".

Only the jiva-soul never decays and eternally remains an individual person.

All the material bodily vessels that the jiva-souls hires from Maha-Visnu's dream, are a permanent fixture in His dreams that are eternally available to those jiva-souls who foolishly choose to enter the material creation.

Srila Prabhupada always encouraged us to have personal realizations.

Keep in mind, the 'dreams' of Maha-Visnu are mind boggling and very complex, and if Arjuna could view past, present and future simultaneously, it only means they all exist simultaneously as he saw it.

I have not found anything on this subject to verify or deny these realizations but this would also mean time travel is possible because the past and future already exist like the beginning, middle and end of a roadway already exists.

However, it would impossible to change the past or future as it is fixed like the roadway is fixed and already built.

One can only travel through what is already there, what already exists like travelling on that road (bodily pathway) that already exists.

Another example is just like when one rewinds a video tape, the contends captured will always be the same at every stage on the tape.

Another explanation is many believe the material body we are now in is a 'post', meaning it is always available for "hire" from the library of Maha-Visnu's dreams. 



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time and space itself is recorded on the eternal level in the material universe and we can take our next birth in a bodily vessel that has already existed in past time, present time or future time.

That means when we choose a bodily vessel, the pathway of that body is already existing in another time zone because each material body is a permanent fixture of this material universe known as the maha-tattva.

What I am trying to say here is all the 'dreams' of Maha-Visnu are all happening 'now' which means past, present and future exist simultaneously and we can move into any bodily vessel that exists in the past, present or the future.

The material energy is all one but NOT the life force that is individual units as Prabhupada has taught us.

This is important to understand as there are many impersonalists who believe there is one all pervasive life force that moves through all material bodily species.

Their ideas are wrong and these ideas has nothing to do with such impersonalism.

In the material creation everything already exists like a long roadway already exists.

Similarly the pathway or roadway of the material bodily vessels, gross or subtle, that we possess, like the roadway, is already carved out and we are simply passengers on that roadway in that bodily vessel container for its journey.

In other words, one who worships the rich and famous can take birth in the material body they worship after being trained up to be qualified to take that birth which in itself would take many, many, many births just for the opportunity to be famous for one insignificant life time.

What a ignorant selfish waste of time.

If those souls in those material vessels knew what they had to go through to attain that famous bodily materialistic existence, they would have second thoughts about seeking material fame and wealth on this planet or the heavenly planets.

Just like one can take the 'post' of Lord Brahma if they are qualified.

So could all materials vessels be 'posts like Brahmas?'

Yes I believe so.

Usually the most pious living entity in this material universe can take up the post of Lord Brahma when the next universe manifeasts.

In the same way; we all take a material bodily vessel according to our pious and impious activities or karma.

All individual living entities perceive time as a chain of events moving through past, present and future.

However, from above, like a journey on a road where one sees the beginning of one's journey to the end, could mean "materially" that all past, present and future exist together like every point on the journey of a roadway does.

Conclusion

The concept in the above essay is suggesting all material pathways always exist allowing others jiva-souls to also traverse the same roadway.

What is said above in this essay is that all material bodily vessels we are in are the property of Maha-Visnu that can only be "hired" from Him.

From Maha-Visnu's dreams, every senerio conceivable is already existing, meaning from His point of view, all past, present and future eternally are existing as Arjuna experienced.

Maha-Visnu's library of dreams are similar to a "costume shop" full of many different costumes (bodily pathways) one can choose to hire from Maha-Visnu and enter.

Every jiva-soul who enters the material creation must first go this so costume shop (the dreams of the sleeping Maha-Visnu) and "hire" a particular material bodily roadway that matches their desires for entering the material creation.

Maha-Visnu owns all such material vessels that are part and parcel with everything else in the material creation He is dreaming.

Therefore, those who have chosen to enter the material creation, must go to Maha-Visnu's dreams and "hire" a material body from His dreaming.

It is these material bodies (from Maha-Visnu's dreams) all jiva-souls must choose from just like one chooses a costumes from a Fancy dress store.

Regarding eternal associates of Krsna like Arjuna.

The fact is, Arjuna is always with Krsna somewhere in the material creation, in innumerable different material universes existing inside each Brahmanda universal shell at the same time.

Therefore, there are many jiva-souls playing the part of Arjuna Prabhupada has explained, why not, he has said.

Also a jiva-soul using their full potential of 78.125% of Krsna's qualities, can expand themselves into many different material bodies but be just the one jiva-soul in up to 8 material bodily vessels.

This is achieved because the one jiva-soul expands himself into up to eight different material bodily vessels that are all controlled by just one jiva-soul.

What about Lord Brahma? 

Each Lord Brahmas in his universe material universes, is a different jiva-soul than all the other Brahmas, they are NOT all the one jiva-soul.

So in every Lord Brahma's body there is a different jiva-soul every time a new material universe is created.

Actually it's the same for all material bodies because they are all 'posts' in the material creation, all "hired" from the dreams of Maha-Visnu.

Therefore all Brahmas are NOT the same jiva-soul, there are millions of different individual jiva-souls playing the role of Brahma, Arjuna, the demigods and within all other material bodily forms.





8 comments:

  1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrqmMoI0wks

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  2. Each vessel is a permanent fixture of the of the mahat tattva or material energy and one has to be qualified to enter into a bodily vessel, such qualification take many life times. Those who are rich and famous or even infamous have taken many life times to reach that bodily vessel on the pathway or fabric of space-time, nothing happens by chance

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  3. You are an interesting thinker. So....you're saying that we have freewill at every moment (i can lift my right hand now or not), but that only some decisions from freewill break us out of our present "universe." And you're saying that we have free will only to pick between what is offered, like a stack of movies that we can pick to watch (and experience directly in this case), but that we can switch movies at any time--although we have a smaller choice than what we're offered when we leave the present body.
    So that helps explain "minute" independence, Independence to choose what already finished movie we want to see. Hmmmm.
    One weird thing is if i made a choice and it presented me with a new universe the actual individuals that i know would be different individuals. I may talk to you today, writing this, but tonight i may make a momentous decision and switch universes....then you'd write me back, if you do, but the person who'd receive you're reply would be???? Who? Not me. How would someone else (who's chosen the body and mind i have right now) get into your universe...
    I'll think a bit more on it.
    thanks for your writing.
    oh and thanks for relieving me from the angst cause by one of those perennial commenters on dadavats who said there were different kinds of jivas-- i was depressed and bothered by that for months.

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  4. The movement of space-time is based on the material body one is in, technically there is no past, present and future.All material vessels Maha Vishnu dreams are eternally available for rent.And yes, you may walk past a material body you once experienced in another time and place millions of life times ago.The fact is, if one made a choice and it put them in a new universe, then the material bodies will look the same but the individual souls in those material vessels would be different individuals than the previous universe you were in.

    I may talk to you today, writing this, but tonight i may make a momentous decision and switch universes, then you'd write me back, if you do, but the person who'd receive you're reply would be???? Who? Not me, another soul with similar desires.

    But what does it matter? We never knew the soul in the other body either to begin with.True identity and form is only known in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavan the perpetual Kingdom of God where one IS their Spiritual body.Also other souls have chosen the material body and mind I am presently in unlimited times.So it is a fact we are not these material bodies!

    Trillions (unlimited) of souls in this way enter the material creation through the dreams of Maha Vishnu and get all the facilities they need to experience their material desires from Lord Brahma down to the ant and lower.

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  5. Material bodily vessels are a permanent fixture or ''post'' of the mahat-tattva space-time traversed by an unlimited number of jivatmas (souls)

    What is really going on in this mundane temporary material World?

    Something to get one thinking.

    We have freewill at every moment (I can lift my right hand now or not), it is freewill and "individual desires" that always exist and can also constantly move us from this reality to another reality (or a new different viewpoint and reality of the material universe) in order that one can experience their material desires.

    It is a state on mind rather than another so called universe, reality, dimension or parallel world.

    And all of us have free will to pick or choose between any material reality as long as we are qualified, trained up and deserve to enter a particular material bodily vessel provided by Maha Vishnu from His "dreaming" of the material creation.

    What ever we desire in this temporary material creation, like watching a stack of movies that we can pick to watch from the DVD library, we similarly experience directly our material desires as long as they are in sync with Maha Vishnu's dreaming of the material creation.

    And all material desires are.

    Maha Vishnu's dreams cover all that is possible, because every combination of matter IS possible and are with His dreaming.

    Therefore there is no material desire no matter how bizarre or strange, that Maha Vishnu cannot provide a material bodily vessel for so the jivatma or soul can experience what ever they desire.

    All that exists and all that did exist and will exist is already part of Maha Vishhu's dreaming.

    Therefore, just like we can switch watching a movie at any time, we can change bodies or even move to a different universe to be in sync with our material desires.

    The majority of jivatmas are not aware this is going on unless they understand the activity in each universe is set in stone and by changing something in the past automatically puts them in a different but almost identical universe where, for example, In a "reality" where President Kennedy was not assassinated.

    If they experience this, then they (now in a different material bodily vessel as well) exist in a totally different universe and material bodily container from the material body and universe they were previously in.

    Therefore our choices are forfilled in a more complicated way that many expect and are not aware of.

    They do not realize we live in an unlimited multi-universe where every conceivable combination of matter "already" exists and has always existed.

    One is constantly moving from material body to material body within multiple realities based on the combination of material desires and karma (reactions from past choices) and do not even know it.

    There are many universes (let's call the realities) that are almost identical, (the word parallel is often used here), they are all real yet like everything in the material creation they are all real but temporary.

    We can drop the word parallel because it has no meaning, the fact is there are just unlimited material realities that have in them all the fascilites to experience every material desire concievable.

    So there is no such thing as a parallel universe.

    This explains how we can have "minute" independence in the the material creation where past, present and future is known simultaneously.

    What is NOT known is the jivatma's desires and how one will desire, therefore the material pathway (bodily vessel) the jivatma chooses is also not known. However, the pathway, or each material body vessel's past, present and future created by Maha Vishnu, IS known.

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  6. All material bodily fascilities (Bodily containers) are already there within Maha Vishnu's dreaming and each dream is like a roadway that has a beginning, middle and end (past, present and future).

    Independence means one is able to choose and enter any bodily vessel from Maha Vishnu's "Costume shop of material vessels" at any time and experience that material body provided by Maha Vishnu in it's individual journey through it's past, present and future.

    The movement of space-time is based on the material body one is in, technically there is no past, present and future above the movement of matter.

    Therefore all material vessel's Maha Vishnu dreams are eternally available for rent.

    And yes, you may walk past a material body you once experienced in another time and place millions of "bodies" or life times ago.

    The fact is, if one made a choice and it put them in a new material body in another reality (universe), then the material bodies will look the same but the individual souls in those material vessels would be different individuals than in the previous universe they were in.

    I may talk to you today, writing this, but tonight i may make a momentous decision and switch universes, then you'd write me back, if you do, but the person who'd receive you're reply would be?? Who? Not me, Yes it would be another soul with similar desires in a material body identical in both realities.

    So what does it matter? One never knew the soul in the other matterial body either to begin with.

    The fact is true identity and form is only known in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavan anyway. Only in the perpetual Kingdom of God is where one IS their Spiritual body that is who they really are.

    The material body is a covering one is provided with when they enter the material creation.

    It is "our material desires" that guide us to the unlimited pathways (material bodies) within the endless dreams of Maha Vishhu to experience our own material dreams.

    Also other souls have chosen the same material body and mind I am presently in unlimited times over the eternity of space-time.

    The reason why there is "eternal reoccurance" is because all material bodies are perpetually part of the dreaming of Maha Vishnu.

    So it is a fact we are NOT these material bodies!

    Trillions (unlimited) number of souls in this way enter the material creation through the dreams of Maha Vishnu and get all the facilities they need to experience their material desires from Lord Brahma down to the ant and lower.

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  7. Material bodily vessels are a permanent fixture or 'posts' of the mahat-tattva (material energy) space and time (past, present and future) traversed by an unlimited number of baddha-jivas ( souls now covered by a material bodily container or vessel.

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  8. Lord Krishna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes, He is the ORIGINAL Form of God from whom ALL His Vishnu and Narayana forms expand from.

    The only difference between Srimati Radharani and Krishna, is that Krishna IS the Supreme Personality of Godhead, and ORIGINAL cause of all causes, and has an extra 4 qualities more than His Vishnu-tattva expansions.

    Therefore, not even Srimati Radharani or Balarama (Krishna's older brother) have 64 unique qualities like Krishna, they also have only 60 qualities which is 93% of Krishna's 64 qualities that is 100%.

    Percentages of Krishna's 64 qualities mathematically work out as -

    Vishnu-tattva Forms of the Lord - How much is 60 out of 64 written as a percentage? Convert fraction (ratio) 60 / 64

    Answer: 93.75%

    Shiva-tattva - How much is 54 out of 64 written as a percentage? Convert fraction (ratio) 54 / 64

    Answer: 84.375%

    Jiva-tattva - How much is 50 out of 64 written as a percentage? Convert fraction (ratio) 50 / 64

    Answer: 78.125%

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