Sunday, May 22, 2022

In the spiritual world all relationships with Krsna are equally blissful to each other.

Just like one may like a carnation flower, while others may choose to like a rose flower.

There is always freedom of expression and choice in the Kingdom of God and all are equally blissful.

This means the individual jiva-souls in the spiritual worlds can always voluntarily express themselves there in their own unique way by offerings personal contributions to Krsna.

Real love or service can only exist when free will allows the jiva-souls to voluntarily participate in loving devotional exchanges and contribute to their relationship with Krsna in their own unique way.

Srila Prabhupada - ''Love means you take and you give also. Suppose if you love somebody and you simply take from him, but you don't give. Oh, do you think it is very good? No. It is not good. That is not love. That is exploitation. If I go on simply taking from you, and if I don't offer you anything, that is simply exploitation." (Lecture on Bhagavad Gita Chapter 9 text 2-5, New York, November 23, 1966)

Srila Prabhupada - "The jiva-soul's position in the spiritual world is voluntary. Some devotees want to serve Krsna as flower; they become flower there. If I want to be a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna and become flower, voluntarily, and can change from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (Srimad Bhagavatam 6.1.1-4 - Melbourne, May 20, 1975)

Srila Prabhupada - "Because you are Son of God you have independence, you have acquired the quality of your father, so God does not interfere with your independence. If you persist that "I must enjoy independently," God says, "All right, you can go." This is the position, if you persist, God sanctions. And you can come here and enjoy." (Melbourne, Australia June 25, 1974)

Srila Prabhupada – "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that is not independence, that is force." (Los Angeles, June 23, 1975)

Srila Prabhupada - Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will. Unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will."

Hayagriva - "A man may know better but still act wrongly."

Srila Prabhupada -"Yes, but that is free will. He misuses his. Just like a thief, he knows that his stealing, it is bad, but still he does it. That is free will. He cannot check his greediness, so in spite of his knowing that he is doing wrong thing—he will be punished, he knows; he has seen another thief, he was punished, he was put into prison— everything he knows, but still he steals. Why? Misuse of free will. Unless there is misuse of free will, there is no question of free will." (Excerpt from: Philosophy Discussions with Srila Prabhupada – Rene Descartes)

The individual jiva-souls are independent living entities in the spiritual worlds and have their own unique personality and sense of self that is separate from Krsna's Personality, yet are simultaneously dependent on Krsna as His parts and parcels.

The reason why Krsna gives the jiva-souls their independence and free will is so they can choose how to serve Him in their own unique personal way, or even reject Him if they choose.

This means the jiva-souls can always contribute their own unique offerings out of unconditional personal love, without the need of any pressure or force from Krsna.

Srila Prabhupada - ''We have got the propensity to love. Love means somebody else. Love cannot be one or love cannot be executed only by one, there must be another one. I love somebody; somebody loves me, there must be lover, there must be beloved, and the transaction, then there is love." (Lecture on Srimad Bhagavatam Canto 1 Chapter 2 text 6, Delhi, November 12, 1973)

Srila Prabhupada - ''The impersonalist philosophy is oneness. So how can there be love with just one? Is it possible? Have you got any such experience? Love means one? No. Love means two. There must be two, the lover and the beloved. Kṛṣṇa is already lover. He's so lover of you that He's trying to get you back. That is Kṛṣṇa's attempt. "Please, My dear boy, or My dear friend, My dear servant..." (Lecture on Srimad Bhagavatam Canto 2 Chapter 1 text 3, Paris, June 12, 1974)

Surrender to Krsna in the spiritual world does not mean giving up your free will and allowing Krsna to control all your every actions, deeds, words and thoughts.

No, the jiva-souls in the spiritual world are not programmed non-thinking drones who only obey and never contribute to the relationship with Krsna in their own unique way by thinking for themselves.

The jiva-souls can never lose their free will in Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavana, or the individual ability of self expression of offering their own personal contributions to Krsna that are unique to each individual jiva-soul.

Only by having free will can genuine loving exchanges and reciprocation take place, and without free will the jiva-soul is no better than dead stone Prabhupada has warned us.

Furthermore, Krsna never interferes with the free will of the jiva-souls because if He did and never allowed them to have their free will to make their own choices in the spiritual world, then that also would mean loving exchanges of voluntarily reciprocation with Krsna would never exist.

If one is forced to worship Krsna or Visnu then that is not out of genuine love.

That impersonal version of Krsna's abode of Goloka-Vrindavana or the Vaikuntha planets where jiva-souls are forced to surrender their free will and allow that bogus version of God to take over your existence by forcing you to do only as you are told denying any personal contributions is bogus and dangerous impersonalism.

Having genuine free will on the other hand, allows the jiva-souls to be themselves, which is an independent unique contributing person who can always voluntarily choose for themselves their own personal offerings to Krsna.

Voluntary service is the bases of real surrender in Goloka-Vrindavana and the Vaikuntha planets which are the permanent eternal homes and origin of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls).

The jiva-souls in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana are forever voluntarily expanding the expression of their unique individuality with an increasing variety of personal devotional offerings based on free will, it is never a nonsense one-sided dictatorial relationship with Krsna as Prabhupada explains.

Krsna does not control the surrendered jiva-souls by force like a puppet master controls every movement of his puppets with the manipulation of the strings, denying self expression, individual contributions and voluntary service.

However, Krsna does control His pure devotees with love, by serving them more than they can ever serve Him.

And the pure devotees reciprocate with unconditional love for Krsna.  

Srila Prabhupada - "Krsna does not want to become a lover by force, from the point of revolver. ‘You love me, otherwise I shall kill you!’ That is not love; that is threatening. Love is reciprocal, voluntary, good exchange of feeling. Then there is love. Not by force; no, that is rape. Why one is called lover, another is called rape?" (July 8, 1976 in Washington, D.C.)

If the jiva-souls had no free will in the spiritual world then they are no better than dead stone Prabhupada tells us.

Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no free will, then you are a stone. The stone has no free will. You want to be stone? Then you must have free will! But don't misuse your free will. But don't try to become stone either. That is not life." (August 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)

Srila Prabhupada - "As living spiritual jiva-souls we are all originally Kṛṣṇa conscious entities, but due to our association with matter since time immemorial, our consciousness is now polluted by material atmosphere. When the superior energy is in contact with inferior energy, it becomes an incompatible situation. But when the supreme marginal potency is in contact with the spiritual potency, Harā, it becomes the happy, normal condition of the living entity. This transcendental vibration of chanting-

Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare/ Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare

This is the sublime method for reviving our Kṛṣṇa consciousness. As living spiritual souls we are all originally Kṛṣṇa conscious entities, but due to our association with matter since time immemorial, our consciousness is now polluted by material atmosphere. In this polluted concept of live, we are all trying to exploit the resources of material nature, but actually we are becoming more and more entangled in her complexities.

This illusion is called māyā, or hard struggle for existence over the stringent laws of material nature. This illusory struggle against the material nature can at once be stopped by revival of our Kṛṣṇa consciousness. (The "Happening Record Album" recorded December 1966 New York City, USA)

Devotee – "When we are in the spiritual sky and serving Krsna, we have a perfect relationship with Krsna, what causes us to fall down in the material world, because we’re already serving Krsna?"

Srila Prabhupada – "Because you desire to fall down. Here it is explained that Don’t fall down."

Devotee – "Srila Prabhupada, I can’t understand why we should have an impure desire when we are already serving…"

Srila Prabhupada – "Because you have got little freedom. Why one is not coming here and going to the liquor shop? It is his desire and free will."

Devotee – "In the Srimad Bhagavatam it says that Krsna did not want us to come to this material world. If Krsna did not want us to come, why are we here?"

Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, you forced Krsna to allow you to come, just like sometimes a child forces his father. Father says, “My dear son, do not do this. Do not go there.” But he insists, “Oh, I must go. I must go.” “All right, you go at your risk and suffer. What can be done? So because you are son of God you have acquired the quality of your father so God does not interfere with your independence (free will)." (Lecture Melbourne, Australia June 25, 1974).

Srila Prabhupada - "Unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will if I can act only one sided? That means I have no free will. Because we can act wrongly, that means we have free will." (Discussions with Srila Prabhupada – Rene Descartes).

The marginal living entities (jiva-souls) never lose their free will because they are eternal as Bhagavad Gita explains,

"For the soul there is never birth nor death. Nor, having once been, does he ever cease to be. He is unborn, eternal, ever-existing, undying and primeval. He is not slain when the body is slain." (BG Chapter 2 Text 20)

Free will has nothing to do with matter (the material body), free will is a symptom of the eternal jiva-soul not dead matter.

Free will is the constitutional makeup of every jiva-soul in Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana where nothing material (Maya) can exists.***

















Saturday, May 21, 2022

Krsna (God) is the source of everything but is also simultaneously the Supreme "PERSON," as an eternal Bodily Form seen in paintings.

God is NOT just an all-pervading consciousness, or only an impersonal force behind everything, no, Krsna (God) is also simultaneously the Supreme "PERSON," as an eternal bodily Form, seen in paintings below.

Only Krsna has 64 qualities in full because He is the original Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes.

The Visnu-tattva (Visnu/Narayana) expansions of Krsna, who are also God, have only 60 of Krsna's 64 attributes or 93.75% of Krsna's qualities.

Some Vedic scholars and modern day Hindu academics can not understand why Krsna has 4 more qualities than Visnu/Narayana and why Krsna is the original Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes.

They cannot understand that Visnu/Narayana are expansions of Krsna and not the other way around, that Krsna originates from Visnu as many Hindus today wrongly believe.

Even the word Hindu is not found in Vedic texts because it is an alien word introduced by European and Islamic invaders to the Indian sub-continent around 2,500 to 1,500 years ago. 

Krsna is not an expansion of Visnu either as many Hindus wrongly believe today.

Krsna is the original Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes from whom all variety of living entities (all life) originates from.

This includes the fallen dormant jiva-souls (marginal living entities) in the impersonal Brahmajyoti, and all non-living matter in the mahat-tattva (material world)

The 4 qualities all other living entities, including Visnu/Narayana expansions do not have in full, are as follows-

(1) Krsna is the performer of wonderful varieties of pastimes (especially His childhood pastimes)

(2) Krsna is surrounded by devotees endowed with wonderful love of Godhead.

(3) Krsna can attract all living entities all over the universes by playing on His flute.

(4) Krsna has a wonderful excellence of beauty which can not be rivalled anywhere in the creation.

These four qualities out of Krsna's 64 attributes are important to understand because, as said, not even Visnu/Narayana  forms of God, who includes Balarama, have them in always, only sometimes exhibited partially when Krsna expands Himself and appears in the material world.

Childhood Krsna never leaves Vrindavana therefore a Visnu-tattva form of Krsna expands and plays the part of Krsna in the material world.

Srimad Bhagavatam - "Sakti means the "energy of Krsna." (SB, Canto 4 Ch 6 text 43)

Krsna has many different energies-

1 - The marginal living entities (jiva-souls) are one of Krsna's energies. 

2 - Matter (mahat-tattva, material energy or maya) is one of Krsna's energies.

3 - The different consorts and associates of Krsna, the internal potency known as Visnu-"sakti"-tattva, are one of Krsna's energies. 

4 - The direct expansions of Krsna known as Visnu-tattva, are one of Krsna's energies.

5 - Lord Siva (Siva-tattva) who is in a league of his own is one of Krsna's energies.  

All the living entity expansions of Krsna are-

1 - Visnu-tattva have 60 qualities out of Krsna's 64 attributes, which is 93.75 of Krsna's total qualities.

2 - Visnu-"sakti"-tattvas also has 60 qualities (this category of "sakti" potency or energy means direct full expansions of Krsna like Srimati Radharani and her Vrindavana associates have 93.75 of Krsna's attributes.

3 - Siva-tattva or Lord Siva has 55 qualities of Krsna's 64 qualities or 85.938% of Krsna's attributes.

4 - Jiva-tattva (the jiva-souls) have 50 of Krsna's 64 qualities, which is 78.125% of Krsna's attributes.

The Supreme Personality of Godhead Lord Krsna has all sixty-four transcendental qualities in full.

So, the difference between Krsna (64 qualities) and Visnu/Narayana (60 qualities) are the four extra qualities that only Krsna has in full.

The full extent of Krsna's wonderful qualities or attributes is inconceivable.

Here are Krsna's 64 qualities-

(1) Beautiful features of the entire body

(2) Marked with all auspicious characteristics

(3) Extremely pleasing

(4) Effulgent

(5) Strong

(6) Ever youthful

(7) Wonderful linguist

(8) Truthful

(9) Talks pleasingly

(10) Fluent

(11) Highly learned

(12) Highly intelligent

(13) Genius

(14) Artistic

(15) Extremely clever

(16) Expert

(17) Grateful

(18) Firmly determined

(19) An expert judge of time and circumstances

(20) Sees and speaks on the authority of Vedas (scriptures)

(21) Pure

(22) Self-controlled

(23) Steadfast

(24) Forbearing

(25) Forgiving

(26) Grave

(27) Self-satisfied

(28) Possessing equilibrium

(29) Magnanimous

(30) Religious

(31) Heroic

(32) Compassionate

(33) Respectful

(34) Gentle

(35) Liberal

(36) Shy

(37) The protector of surrendered souls

(38) Happy

(39) The well-wisher of devotees

(40) Controlled by love

(41) all-auspicious

(42) Most powerful

(43) all-famous

(44) Popular

(45) Partial to devotees

(46) Very attractive to all women

(47) all-worship able

(48) all-opulent

(49) all-honourable

(50) The supreme controller.

(51) Changeless

(52) all-cognizant

(53) Ever fresh

(54) sac-cid-ananda-vigraha as an eternal spiritual "Bodily Form."

(55) Possessing all mystic perfections.

(56) He has inconceivable potency.

(57) Uncountable universes generate from His body.

(58) He is the original source of all incarnations.

(59) He is the giver of salvation to the enemies whom He kills.

(60) He is the attractor of liberated souls.

As explained above, besides these sixty transcendental qualities, Krsna has four more not manifested even in the Visnu/Narayana form of Godhead, what to speak of the demigods or living entities.

They are as follows-

(61) He is the performer of wonderful varieties of pastimes (especially His childhood pastimes).

(62) He is surrounded by devotees endowed with wonderful love of Godhead.

(63) He can attract all living entities all over the universes by playing on His flute.

(64) He has a wonderful excellence of beauty that can not be rivalled anywhere in the creation.

The Absolute Truth Lord Krsna is anandamaya (desiring to increase His joy), hence, from Krsna's original form, He expands and becomes many.

These emanations from the Supreme Person are of two categories: full expansions and partially manifested expansions.

The Lord's various full and partial expansions and the Lord Himself simultaneously co-exist, only appearing to manifest under the influence of time.

These expansions of Krsna are known as Visnu-tattva Forms of God, and they are also the Supreme Absolute Truth such as-

Balarama, 

Pradyumna, 

Ramachandra, 

Narsingadeva,  

Narayana, 

Visnu,

Maha-Visnu, 

Garbhodakashayi Visnu, etc.

All expansions of Krsna are His "sakti energies."

Srila Prabhupada - "Sakti means the energy of Krsna." (SB, Canto 4 Ch 6 text 43)

Radharani and many other inhabitants including many gopis and gopas who are technically Krsna Himself playing a role in His own Vrindavana pastimes are therefore called Visnu-"sakti"-tattva, and serve Krsna alongside the jiva-souls.

All Visnu-tattvas (like Balarama) and other Visnu-"sakti"-tattvas like Srimati Radharani accept their own role in the mood of Servitor to the "original" Supreme Being Lord Krsna.

And then there is Visnu-"sakti"-tattvas like Radharani, associates and many other inhabitants including many gopis and gopas who are technically Krsna Himself playing a role in His own Vrindavana pastimes alongside the jiva-souls.

All Visnu-tattva and Visnu-"sakti"-tattva accept their own role in the mood of Servitor to the "original" Supreme Being Lord Krsna.

For example, Visnu/Narayana Forms of God are known by many different unlimited names on their particular Vaikuntha planet in the Spiritual sky.

This relationship is the foundation of Vedic monotheism, which encompasses the inconceivable, absolute personal nature of the original Godhead.

As explained above, Lord Krsna possesses two other expansive qualities known as Siva-tattva and jiva-tattva (jiva-souls). 

Together with Visnu-tattva and Visnu-"sakti"-tattvas, these four personalities are representative of the Absolute Person's (Krsna's) internal, external, and marginal energies.

The Lord expands Himself as Lord Siva and Lord Brahma, and the marginal living entities (jiva-souls) are also expansions. Like us, Lord Brahma is also jiva-tattva or jiva-soul (78.125%)

Lord Siva is between Visnu-tattva and jiva-tattva. Lord Siva has 85.938% of Krsna's qualities which is 55 of Krsna's 64 attributes.

Lord Visnu/Narayana is Visnu-tattva (93.75%)

And Radharani is Visnu-"sakti"-tattva (93.75%), which only means she does not always exhibit Krsna's four extra qualities always in full.

When Krsna desired to experience loving affection and exchanges with a woman, He expanded Himself as Srimati Radharani, who is none different than Krsna.

Visnu-tattva and jiva-tattva are different categories of living entities but are all expansions of the Supreme Personality of Godhead Lord Krsna.

Therefore, as a reminder, we can summarize as follows-

Lord Krsna has all His 64 qualities (100%)

Visnu-tattva has 60 qualities of Krsna's 64 attributes (93.75%)

Visnu-"sakti"-tattvas also has 60 of Krsna's 64 attributes (93.75%)

Siva-tattva has 55 qualities of Krsna's 64 attributes (85.938%)

Jiva-tattva (jiva-souls) has 50 qualities of Krsna's 64 attributes (78.125%)

This is the reason why Krsna is called Param Purushottam, Purnavatar or Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes. 

Srila Prabhupada - "Learned scholars in transcendental subjects have carefully analyzed the summum bonum Krsna to have sixty-four principal attributes. All the expansions or categories of the Lord possess only some percentages of these attributes. But Sri Krsna is the possessor of the attributes cent percent. His personal expansions such as svayam-prakasa, tad-ekatma up to the categories of the avataras who are all visnu-tattva, possess up to 93.75% of these transcendental attributes." (SB, Canto 1 Ch 3 Text 29)

Lord Siva is neither avatara nor avesa, nor in between them; he possesses 85.938% of Krsna's attributes (having 55 qualities out of Krsna's 64 qualities).

The jiva-souls or the individual marginal living entities, possess up to the limit of 78.125% of Krsns's attributes.

The jiva-souls can never be Visnu-tattva (God) or Siva-tattva. Siva is a devotee of Krsna in a mysterious category of his own. Siva is not Visnu-tattva (God) or jiva-tattva.

In the conditioned state in material existence, the marginal living entities (jiva-souls) exhibit up to 50 of these attributes in very minute quantity in the material creation, varying in terms of the pious and impious life of the living being, where as in the spiritual world all 50 qualities are exhibited.

Only in the spiritual world are the jiva-soul's full potential fully experienced.

The most perfect of living beings in this material universe is Brahma, the supreme administrator of each material universe deep inside their surrounding Brahmanda greater universe.

Lord Brahma, who is also jiva-soul, possesses 78.125% per cent of Krsna's 100% attributes, he cannot possess anymore than that.

All the demigods except Siva have only 78.125% attributes or have 50 of Krsna's 64 qualities also. 

All jiva-souls trapped in the 8 million 400 thousand species of material life, also possess these same attributes in their full potential in the spiritual world but presently covered by material energy.

The standard of perfection for a human form of life is to realize their full potential as the jiva-soul within the material body that has of 78.125% of Krsna's quantities. 

The marginal living entities or jiva-souls can never possess attributes like Siva, Visnu, Radharani, Balarama or Lord Krsna.

The marginal living entities (jiva-souls) can become godly by developing their full potential of 78.125% of Krsna's qualities but can never become a God like Krsna or Visnu (93.75%), or Personality like Siva (85.938%).

Although the jiva-souls can become a Brahma in due course as mentioned above.

The godly living beings who are all residents of the Vaikuntha planets in the spiritual sky are eternal associates of Visnu in different spiritual planets called Hari-dhama and Mahesa-dhama.

However, the abode of Lord Krsna Goloka Vrindavana is above all the Vaikuntha planets and is called Krsnaloka or Goloka Vrndavana.

The marginal living entity (jiva-soul) can develop 78.125% of the above attributes in full, which is their full potential; they can NEVER become Krsna, Visnu or Siva.

By reaching their full potential of 78.125%, the jiva-souls can again enter the planet of Krsna-loka (Goloka-Vrindavana) or the Vaikuntha planets after leaving their present decaying material bodily vessel in the material creation.

Srila Prabhupada - "The answer to your question about the "marginal living entities" is that the jiva-soul is always called marginal energy whether he is in the spiritual world or in the material world. There are instances where marginal energy jiva-souls have fallen from the spiritual world, just like Jaya and Vijaya. So the potency to fall under the influence of the lower energy is always there. And thus the individual jiva-soul is called as Krsna’s marginal energy." (Letter to Rayarama, Dec 2, 1968)

The full potential and original feature of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls), is a "two-arm form" like Krsna's Body.

Srila Prabhupada - "God is also human form. "Man is made after the shape of God." So Kṛṣṇa is also like human form, two hands, two legs." The human form is also the full manifestation of the jiva-soul." (Melb, Australia May 20, 1975)

Srila Prabhupada - "The spirit soul is NOT formless; it has got form, the spirit soul always has form and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. But with our material eyes at the present, our gross eyes, we cannot see these facts; therefore we foolishly believe the jiva-souls have no form." (Lecture BG, Ch 2 Text 14 - Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)

Devotee - "What is the form of the spiritual body. If the spirit soul is non-material, what is the form?"

Srila Prabhupāda - "There is form, just like this material body is compared with the dress. Now, just like in your present material form you have got hand; therefore your coat has got hand. You have got legs; therefore your pant has got legs. Therefore it is to be assumed that the spirit soul always has got form, and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. The spirit soul is not formless; it has got form. But with our material eyes at the present, gross eyes, we cannot find it; therefore we say and foolishly believe it has no form." (Lecture BG, Ch 2 Text 14, Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)

As said above, the full potential and original feature of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls) is a two-arm, two leg spiritual bodily form like Krsna's Body, and do NOT originate from the impersonal Brahmajyoti as impersonalists foolishly believe.

Devotee – "Is the original body of the spirit soul a human form?"

Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, human form. God is also human form. "Man is made after the shape of God." I think there is in the Bible. Is it not? So God is also like human form. Here you see Krsna, two hands, two legs."

Hari-sauri – "How do we understand, then, that there are peacocks and flowers and trees in the spiritual world? Are these not eternal forms?"

Srila Prabhupada – "[describing material form first]: Yes. They are more covered. Just like if you cover your body with blanket, the hands and legs are invisible. But you are not the blanket. So the trees and plants, they are more covered. They are not in full manifestation. The human form is the full manifestation of the soul."

Hari-sauri - "They are covered in the spiritual world?"

Srila Prabhupada - "Not in the spiritual world, there that is voluntary, some devotee wants to serve Krsna as flower; they become flower there. If I want to be a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna, he becomes flower, voluntarily, and he can change his, from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (SB, Canto 6 Ch 1 Text1-4 - Melb, Australia May 20, 1975)

The jiva-souls are eternal spiritual living PERSONS as a spiritual bodily form and can never be destroyed, terminated or extinguished, the jiva-souls are indestructible.

Bhagavad Gita As It Is - "For the soul there is neither birth nor death at any time. He has not come into being, does not come into being, and will not come into being. He is unborn, eternal, ever-existing and primeval. He is not slain when the body is slain." (BG, Ch 2 text 20 “corrected” 1983 edition)

Bhagavad Gita As It Is - “Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor in the future shall any of us cease to be.” (BG, Ch 2 Text 12)

Srila Prabhupada – “There are no new souls, new and old are due to this material body, but the jiva-soul is never born and never dies, so if there is no birth, how can there be new souls?” (Letter to Jagadisa dasa, 7/9/1970)

There is no origin to Krsna's marginal energy (an unlimited number of individual jiva-souls), who have existed for as long as Krsna has existed, and NEVER created, which is eternity. 

Being an "inactive" (dormant) so-called "spiritual spark" in the impersonal Brahmajyoti is an already fallen unnatural condition of the jiva-soul, who in their full potential, are a spiritual bodily PERSON fully active like Krsna in the spiritual world serving Him explained above, which is the jiva-soul's natural eternal home.

Krsna's effulgence is known as the dormant (inactive) [impersonal] Brahmajyoti made up of a collective of "inactive" individual jiva-souls appearing there after being frustrated with the material world's temporary bodily vessels to become a bodiless "spiritual individual sparks" in the impersonal Brahmajyoti which is also a "fallen" unnatural conditioned state of the jiva-soul.

As said above, appearing in that "fallen condition" as a spiritual spark is an unnatural condition of the jiva-soul, who in their full potential IS a PERSON as a spiritual bodily form in their eternal natural state, serving Krsna the Supreme Lord.

Srila Prabhupada - "Existence in the impersonal Brahmajyoti is also within the category of non-Krsna consciousness and a fallen condition therefore, those who are in the brahman effulgence are also in a fallen condition, so there is no question of falling down from a fallen condition. We do not accept anyone elevated to the brahman effulgence as actually liberated, the living entities first falling down to this material world are NOT from the impersonal brahman. When fall takes place, it means falling down from the non-fallen condition and that non-fallen condition is Krsna cconsciousness. 

So long one can maintain pure Krsna consciousness he is NOT fallen down. As soon as he becomes out of Krsna consciousness immediately he is fallen down. Those who are thinking that they are liberated by being situated in brahman effulgence are described in the Srimad-Bhagavatam as impurely intelligent. So, we do not accept anyone elevated to the brahman effulgence as actually liberated. In other words, they are actually not liberated, and because they are not actually liberated they again come down to the material world." (Letter to  Revatinandana dasa, Los Angeles 13 June, 1970)

As said above, appearing in that "fallen condition" as a "spiritual spark" is the unnatural condition of the jiva-soul, who in their full potential IS a PERSON as a spiritual bodily form associating with Krsna in His eternal pastimes.

The full potential and original feature of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls), is a "two-arm form" like Krsna's Body.^*

















Friday, May 20, 2022

Swedish man - ''Is there free will?''

Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, just like you are sitting here. If you don’t like, you can go away. That’s your free will. There is free will, we are part and parcel of God, therefore we have got minute quantity of freedom." (Temple lecture Stockholm Sweden 1973)

Srila Prabhupada - "Every individual jiva-soul is awarded a portion of independence because each are part and parcel of God, thus he has the quality of independence, but in minute quantity, that is his individuality."

Syamasundara dasa - "Does the individual jiva-soul have a little independence to choose?"

Srila Prabhupada - "No (not without the sanction of Krsna) Bhagavad-Gita states that when the individual soul wants to act, Krsna firsts gives the orders of sanction. Man proposes, and God disposes."

Syamasundara dasa - "So we have no free will?"

Srila Prabhupada - "Not without the sanction of Krsna first, without Him we cannot do anything. Krsna is the ultimate cause of all causes."

Syamasundara dasa - "But I thought you have been saying that we have a little independence."

Srila Prabhupada - "We have independence in the sense that we may deny or affirm, but unless Krsna sanctions, we cannot do anything." (Dialectical Spiritualism: A Vedic View of Western Philosophy)

Srila Prabhupada here is confirming everything comes from Krsna and He alone is the cause of all causes therefore everything must first be sanctioned by Krsna, including free will because Krsna is the the ultimate  cause of all causes, including the "sanction" of free expression.

Nothing can happen without the sanction of Krsna first because eveything comes from Him, nothing is fully independent from Krsna because everything is dependent on His energy, not a even a blade of grass can move without first being sanctioned by Krsna.

However, Krsna will ALWAYS sanction free will because it allows the self expression of voluntary contributions. 

This allows the jiva-souls to act independently from Krsna's dominance regarding decision making by being able to choose for themselves how to act including accepting Kṛṣṇa, or rejecting Krsna.

There is no free will unless the ability to choose exists for the jiva-souls, this includes the choice to accept or reject Krsna.

Without the free will that gives one a sense of independent self, the jiva-souls can never voluntary contribute to their relationship with Krsna in their own unique way. 

This is why "real love or service" can only exists in a "two-way" exchange of feelings where "two" are always involved in voluntary reciprocal exchange with each other.  

Otherwise the jiva-souls are no better than dead stone existing like mindless lifeless puppets under the manipulative control of the puppet master. 

If Krsna denies the jiva-souls their free will, then that denies them from being able to express themselves in their own unique way as an "independent person" separate from Krsna's Personality. 

 Although Srila Prabhupada makes the point above that everything is under His control as the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes, as the Bhagavad-gita teaches us-

Srila Prabhupāda - "Not a blade of grass moves without the will of the Lord." (BG, Ch 7 Text 21, Purport)

This is hard to understand because simultaneously the jiva-souls MUST have their feeling of being independent from Krsna too that allows them to make their own choices.

If Krsna must always have complete control over the jiva-soul's personal decision making, then I reject Him being the Supreme Being!

Already I have made it clear I do NOT agree with everything Prabhupada says, like the Moons distance to the earth and astronauts visiting the Moon between 1969 and 1972. But in most cases I do.

The jiva-souls have free will because it allows them to voluntarily contribute to the relationship with Krsna in their own way, or even reject Krsna if they choose.

Voluntary freedom of self expression must always exist because it proves free will exists.

Bali Mardana - "An example of free will is someone can choose Kṛṣṇa or turn away? ISP O pool p that an example of free will?"

Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes, because if you accept Kṛṣṇa, then you must follow what Kṛṣṇa says. If you don't follow Kṛṣṇa, then what is the use of talking of Kṛṣṇa? If he accepts Kṛṣṇa, he must abide by the injunction of Kṛṣṇa." (Morning Walk, Jan 22, 1974, Hawaii)

Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)

Srila Prabhupada  - "Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will. Unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will."

Hayagriva - "A man may know better but still act wrongly."

Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, but that is free will but misuses his free will, just like a thief who knows he is stealing, it is bad, but still he does it. That is free will. He cannot check his greediness, so in spite of his knowing that he is doing wrong thing—he will be punished, he knows; he has seen another thief, he was punished, he was put into prison— everything he knows, but still he steals. Why? Misuse of free will. But unless there can be misuse of free will, then there is no question of free will." (Philosophy Discussions on Rene Descartes)

Srila Prabhupada – "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one-way only, that is not independence, that is force." (Los Angeles, June 23, 1975)

Krsna never forces the jiva-souls to worship Him, that must be voluntary, and their choice.

Without free will in the spiritual world's of Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana, would only make the jiva-souls emotionless and mindless like dead stone!

Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no free will, then you are a stone. The stone has no free will. You want to be stone? Then you must have free will!" (Aug, 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)

Krsna allows this freedom because without free will, loving exchanges, reciprocation and voluntary offerings would never exist. 

Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence therefore you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God you have got independence, proportionately, that independence has to be accepted, little independence. We can misuse that." (Mayapur, Feb, 19, 1976)

Having free will is the constitutional make up of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls) that is always part and parcel of their eternal character and personality in the spiritual worlds.

Srila Prabhupāda – "Unless there are two consenting persons, where is the question of love? Love means two persons, then there is exchange, then there is love. I must deal with you open-hearted, you must deal with me open-hearted, then there is love. So if you want to love Kṛṣṇa, God, then these things must be there." (Aug 9, 1976, Tehran)

The individual jiva-souls (marginal living entities) can never exist independently from Krsna, even though they can express their own independent free will separate from Krsna that ultimately Krsna provides anyway.

So the conclusion is, Krsna provides the jiva-souls with free will for the purpose of allowing them to contribute in "two-sided" exchange with Him based on voluntary loving expressions and offerings.

We must never forget that Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes, if we properly understand this, then we will understand the above comments by Prabhupada that everything comes from Krsna for a purpose, including free will..×^..