Friday, May 20, 2022

Swedish man - ''Is there free will?''

Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, just like you are sitting here. If you don’t like, you can go away. That’s your free will. There is free will, we are part and parcel of God, therefore we have got minute quantity of freedom." (Temple lecture Stockholm Sweden 1973)

Srila Prabhupada - "Every individual jiva-soul is awarded a portion of independence because each are part and parcel of God, thus he has the quality of independence, but in minute quantity, that is his individuality."

Syamasundara dasa - "Does the individual jiva-soul have a little independence to choose?"

Srila Prabhupada - "No (not without the sanction of Krsna) Bhagavad-Gita states that when the individual soul wants to act, Krsna firsts gives the orders of sanction. Man proposes, and God disposes."

Syamasundara dasa - "So we have no free will?"

Srila Prabhupada - "Not without the sanction of Krsna first, without Him we cannot do anything. Krsna is the ultimate cause of all causes."

Syamasundara dasa - "But I thought you have been saying that we have a little independence."

Srila Prabhupada - "We have independence in the sense that we may deny or affirm, but unless Krsna sanctions, we cannot do anything." (Dialectical Spiritualism: A Vedic View of Western Philosophy)

Srila Prabhupada here is confirming everything comes from Krsna and He alone is the cause of all causes therefore everything must first be sanctioned by Krsna, including free will because Krsna is the the ultimate  cause of all causes, including the "sanction" of free expression.

Nothing can happen without the sanction of Krsna first because eveything comes from Him, nothing is fully independent from Krsna because everything is dependent on His energy, not a even a blade of grass can move without first being sanctioned by Krsna.

However, Krsna will ALWAYS sanction free will because it allows the self expression of voluntary contributions. 

This allows the jiva-souls to act independently from Krsna's dominance regarding decision making by being able to choose for themselves how to act including accepting Kṛṣṇa, or rejecting Krsna.

There is no free will unless the ability to choose exists for the jiva-souls, this includes the choice to accept or reject Krsna.

Without the free will that gives one a sense of independent self, the jiva-souls can never voluntary contribute to their relationship with Krsna in their own unique way. 

This is why "real love or service" can only exists in a "two-way" exchange of feelings where "two" are always involved in voluntary reciprocal exchange with each other.  

Otherwise the jiva-souls are no better than dead stone existing like mindless lifeless puppets under the manipulative control of the puppet master. 

If Krsna denies the jiva-souls their free will, then that denies them from being able to express themselves in their own unique way as an "independent person" separate from Krsna's Personality. 

 Although Srila Prabhupada makes the point above that everything is under His control as the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes, as the Bhagavad-gita teaches us-

Srila Prabhupāda - "Not a blade of grass moves without the will of the Lord." (BG, Ch 7 Text 21, Purport)

This is hard to understand because simultaneously the jiva-souls MUST have their feeling of being independent from Krsna too that allows them to make their own choices.

If Krsna must always have complete control over the jiva-soul's personal decision making, then I reject Him being the Supreme Being!

Already I have made it clear I do NOT agree with everything Prabhupada says, like the Moons distance to the earth and astronauts visiting the Moon between 1969 and 1972. But in most cases I do.

The jiva-souls have free will because it allows them to voluntarily contribute to the relationship with Krsna in their own way, or even reject Krsna if they choose.

Voluntary freedom of self expression must always exist because it proves free will exists.

Bali Mardana - "An example of free will is someone can choose Kṛṣṇa or turn away? ISP O pool p that an example of free will?"

Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes, because if you accept Kṛṣṇa, then you must follow what Kṛṣṇa says. If you don't follow Kṛṣṇa, then what is the use of talking of Kṛṣṇa? If he accepts Kṛṣṇa, he must abide by the injunction of Kṛṣṇa." (Morning Walk, Jan 22, 1974, Hawaii)

Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)

Srila Prabhupada  - "Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will. Unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will."

Hayagriva - "A man may know better but still act wrongly."

Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, but that is free will but misuses his free will, just like a thief who knows he is stealing, it is bad, but still he does it. That is free will. He cannot check his greediness, so in spite of his knowing that he is doing wrong thing—he will be punished, he knows; he has seen another thief, he was punished, he was put into prison— everything he knows, but still he steals. Why? Misuse of free will. But unless there can be misuse of free will, then there is no question of free will." (Philosophy Discussions on Rene Descartes)

Srila Prabhupada – "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one-way only, that is not independence, that is force." (Los Angeles, June 23, 1975)

Krsna never forces the jiva-souls to worship Him, that must be voluntary, and their choice.

Without free will in the spiritual world's of Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana, would only make the jiva-souls emotionless and mindless like dead stone!

Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no free will, then you are a stone. The stone has no free will. You want to be stone? Then you must have free will!" (Aug, 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)

Krsna allows this freedom because without free will, loving exchanges, reciprocation and voluntary offerings would never exist. 

Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence therefore you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God you have got independence, proportionately, that independence has to be accepted, little independence. We can misuse that." (Mayapur, Feb, 19, 1976)

Having free will is the constitutional make up of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls) that is always part and parcel of their eternal character and personality in the spiritual worlds.

Srila Prabhupāda – "Unless there are two consenting persons, where is the question of love? Love means two persons, then there is exchange, then there is love. I must deal with you open-hearted, you must deal with me open-hearted, then there is love. So if you want to love Kṛṣṇa, God, then these things must be there." (Aug 9, 1976, Tehran)

The individual jiva-souls (marginal living entities) can never exist independently from Krsna, even though they can express their own independent free will separate from Krsna that ultimately Krsna provides anyway.

So the conclusion is, Krsna provides the jiva-souls with free will for the purpose of allowing them to contribute in "two-sided" exchange with Him based on voluntary loving expressions and offerings.

We must never forget that Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes, if we properly understand this, then we will understand the above comments by Prabhupada that everything comes from Krsna for a purpose, including free will..×^..



















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