Sunday, October 23, 2022

The original bodily form of the jiva-soul (marginal living entity) is a 2 armed bodily form like Krsnas.

Srila Prabhupada - "The spirit soul is NOT formless; it has got form, the spirit soul always has form and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. But with our material eyes at the present, our gross eyes, we cannot see these facts; therefore we foolishly believe the jiva-souls have no form." (Lecture BG 2.14, Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)

From that original form of the jiva-soul all other forms are voluntary and possible, such as the 4 armed form on the Vaikuntha planets similar to Lord Visnu's Body. So being an inactive "spark in the Brahmajyoti" are a already fallen condition. One's original feature and full potential as a person is a bodily form like Krsnas

Man is made in the image of God.

All jiva-souls eternally are a spiritual bodily form. Only when the jiva-souls are fallen do they appear as a formless or impersonal spark or bodiless individual unit in Krsna's effulgence (the impersonal brahmajyoti)

Krsna is behind everything. Both "all-pervasive impersonally" and a individual PERSON as an eternal bodily form.

Ultimately, we are individual PERSONS as an eternal spiritual bodily form in our eternal full potential. 

This is our original position, and not some bodiless dormant spark in the impersonal Brahman or Brahmajyoti.

Originally our bodily appearance is similar to Krsna's form, but we can voluntarily change that at ant time and be a flower, or a tree, or gopi, or cowherd boy, a chair Krsna sits on, or the grass Krsna walks on, or a cloud in the sky Krsna admires, the choices are unlimited.

You can be the flag pole on Krsna's chariot, or even Krsna's chariot, and at any moment change back to a 2 armed or 4 armed human like form. No bodily form is fixed in the Spiritual worlds, your rasa can constantly change.

It is all voluntary, you can be what ever you want to be if it is you genuine desire to please or amuse Krsna.

Srila Prabhupada - "In the spiritual world our relationship with Krsna or Visnu is voluntary. Some devotee wants to serve Krsna as flower; they become flower there. If I want to be a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna, he becomes flower, voluntarily, and he can change from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (SB Canto 6 Ch 1 text 1-4, Melb May 20, 1975)

In the spiritual worlds the choice of the jiva-soul's relationship with Krsna is voluntary from a blade of grass to a tree, a cow or gopi.

Their individual contributions are eternally expressed in both Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana in a "two-way' reciprocal exchange with Krsna in unlimited different ways and bodily forms over eternity.

Only the "eternal presence" of Krsna exists in the spiritual worlds, where as in the "material creation" time is divided into "past, present and future" which causes a progressive state of decay, decline, impermanence birth and death.

In the spiritual worlds the jiva-souls are never forced to surrender to Krsna or do anything they choose not to do, everything there is voluntary.

Also there is no best bodily form in the Spiritual worlds because all are equally blissful and equal to each other.

From the two armed bodily form in Vrindavana to the 4 armed bodily form in Vaikuntha, to being a cow, an ant, a bee, a cloud in the sky, a bench, a fence, etc etc. every aspect of the Spiritual worlds are alive with unlimited individuals, nothing material (dead) can exist there.

All jiva-souls as what ever form they choose to be are equally blissful with the human form.

The human form is not higher or better than any other form one may choice to be in Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavana.

Just like in this world some like carnation flowers while others prefer roses, it's an individual choice which is best for you.

Although even though everything is equally blissful in the spiritual world, there are 5 different relationships with Krsna, with each one gradually becoming more intimate than the previous one.

One's original 2 armed spiritual body is always there as the basis, there is just a transformation of your spiritual body into a form you voluntarily choose.

From human form to a blade of grass, a cow, a horse, a chair, a cloud in the sky, a Peacock, a different type of human, a four armed form like Narayanas on a Vaikuntha planet, billions of different choices.

This is called a shape shifter, just like once you appeared as a baby but now are an adult, same person, different body, a similar type of shape shifting ftom childhood, to youth, to middle age, to old age - same person, different body.

Devotee - "What is the form of the spiritual body. If the spirit soul is non-material, what is the form?"

Srila Prabhupāda - "There is form, just like this material body is compared with the dress. Now, just like in your present material form you have got hand; therefore your coat has got hand. You have got legs; therefore your pant has got legs. Therefore it is to be assumed that the spirit soul always has got form, and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. The spirit soul is not formless; it has got form. But with our material eyes at the present, gross eyes, we cannot find it; therefore we say and foolishly believe it has no form." (Lecture BG 2.14, Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)

The full potential and original eternal feature of all marginal living entities is a two-arm form like Krsna's Body.

Devotee – "Is the original body of the spirit soul a human form?" 

Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, human form, God is also human form. "Man is made after the shape of God." I think there is in the Bible. Is it not? So God is also like human form. Here you see Krsna, two hands, two legs."

Hari-sauri – "How do we understand, then, that there are peacocks and flowers and trees in the spiritual world? Are these not eternal forms?"

Srila Prabhupada – "[describing material form first]: Yes. They are more covered. Just like if you cover your body with blanket, the hands and legs are invisible. But you are not the blanket. So the trees and plants, they are more covered. They are not in full manifestation. The human form is the full manifestation of the soul."

Hari-sauri - "They are covered in the spiritual world?"

Srila Prabhupada - "Not in the spiritual world. There that is voluntary. Some devotee wants to serve Krsna as flower; they become flower there. If I want to be a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna, he becomes flower, voluntarily, and he can change his, from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (SB, Canto 6 Ch 1 text 1-4, Melb, May 20, 1975)

Fortunately, over 90% of jiva-souls choose to stay in the spiritual world's of Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana even though they can choose to leave if they want. Therefore, less than 10% DO choose to leave and enter the material creation via the dreams of Maha-Visnu.

Dr. John Mize – "Did all the jiva-souls that were in the spiritual sky (the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka Vrindavan) fall out of the spiritual sky at once or at different times, or are there any jiva-souls that are always good, they’re not foolish, they don’t fall down?"

Srila Prabhupada – "No, there are majority, 90%, they are always good. They never fall down."

Dr. John Mize – "So we’re among the 10%."

Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, or less than that. In the material, whole material world all the living entities they are… Just like in the prison house, there is some population, but they are not majority. The majority of the population, they are outside the prison house. Similarly, majority of living being, part and parcel of God, they are in the spiritual world. Only a few fall down." (BG, As It Is. lecture, Mayapur, June 20, 1973)

The jiva-souls have the free will to make their own choices which includes even rejecting Krsna. 

If free will is to truly exist, this choice also MUST be an option. This is why in the spiritual worlds the jiva-soul's relationship with Krsna is always voluntary. In this way, their individual contributions are eternally expressed in both Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana in a two-way reciprocal exchange with Krsna, the jiva-souls are never forced to surrender to Krsna or do anything they choose not to do. 

For loving voluntary service and exchanges to truly exist, the individual jiva-souls must be able to act on their free will and make their own choices, decisions and offerings, even if it also means rejecting Krsna if they choose, otherwise there can be no question of voluntary loving exchanges.

Each jiva-soul can voluntarily express themselves as an independent individual to experience unique loving exchanges and personal service.

This quality of free will is part and parcel of the jiva-soul's marginal constitution that allows them to be an independent free thinking expansion of the Krsna. Therefore, being marginal (jiva-soul) also means having free will that is included when describing the qualities of the individual jiva-souls. 

As said above, Krsna allows this freedom the jiva-souls have because without free will, loving exchanges, personal offerings and a two-way reciprocal relationship could never exist.

Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence therefore you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God you have got independence, proportionately, therefore if he likes he can return to the material atmosphere. That independence has to be accepted, little independence. We can misuse that." (Mayapur, Feb 19, 1976)

The jiva-souls have the free will to make their own choices which includes even rejecting Krsna therefore, in the spiritual worlds the jiva-soul's relationship with Krsna is always voluntary.

Their individual contributions are eternally expressed in both Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana in "two-way" reciprocal exchanges with Krsna.

In the spiritual worlds the jiva-souls a⁸iììĺ ll O ĺre never forced to surrender to Krsna or do anything they choose not to do. 

For loving service and exchanges to truly exist, the individual jiva-souls must be able to act on their free will and make their own choices, decisions and offerings, even if it means rejecting Krsna, otherwise there can be no question of genuine voluntary loving exchanges.

Each jiva-soul can voluntarily express themselves as an independent individual to experience unique loving exchanges and personal service.

Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)

This quality of free will is part and parcel of the jiva-soul's marginal constitution that allows them to be an independent free thinking expansion of the Krsna. 

Therefore being marginal (jiva-soul) also means having free will that is included when describing the qualities of the individual jiva-souls. 

As said above, Krsna allows this freedom the jiva-souls have because without free will loving exchanges, personal offerings and a two-way reciprocal relationship could never exist.

Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence therefore you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God you have got independence, proportionately, therefore if he likes he can return to the material atmosphere. That independence has to be accepted, little independence. We can misuse that." (Mayapur, Feb 19, 1976) 

Having free will is the constitutional make up of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls) that is eternally part and parcel of their individual character and personality in the spiritual worlds.

This means the jiva-souls can choose to leave the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka-Vrindavana if they choose, at anytime, it is nonsense to claim the jiva-souls can never again fall down once in Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana.

This is because free will always allows the choice to choose, and without the ability to voluntarily choose, there is no question of loving exchanges. So, the choice to even leave Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavana is possible because Krsna allows a two-way relationship where one can accept or reject Krsna if they choose.

Srila Prabhupada - "Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will, unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will."

Hayagriva - "A man may know better but still act wrongly."

Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, but that is free will He misuses his. Just like a thief, he knows that his stealing is bad but still he does it. That is free will. He cannot check his greediness, so in spite of his knowing that he is doing wrong thing—he will be punished, he knows; he has seen another thief, he was punished, he was put into prison— everything he knows, but still he steals. Why? Misuse of free will. Unless there is misuse of free will, there is no question of free will." (Prabhupada talk about the philosophy of Rene Descartes)

There is only one classification of jiva-souls, not two as some believe. Therefore each individual jiva-soul has "two-sides" to their personality, they can either be "nitya-baddha" (eternally conditioned), or "nitya-siddha" (eternally liberated)

The term "eternally liberated or nitya-siddha" means only  eternal while being nitya-siddha. However, the "nitya-siddhas" can fall from the position of eternally liberated (nitya-siddha) to enter eternally conditioned (nitya-baddha)

It means the position is eternal liberated (nitya-siddha) and eternally conditioned (nitya-baddha) are an eternal "posts" and not the jiva-souls holding those positions. In this way the jiva-souls can choose for themselves to be with Krsna, or reject Krsna. This is because each jiva-soul, as part of their spiritual constitutional make-up, has free will.

Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)

Srila Prabhupada – "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that is not independence; that is force." (Los Angeles, June 23, 1975)

Some wrongly claim there are two types of jiva-souls- 

1 - One who stays in the Vaikuṇṭha and Goloka Vṛndāvana and never has a choice to go to the material creation (nitya-siddha)

2 - And the other in the material creation (nitya-baddha) who can also be dormant (inactive) in the impersonal Brahmajyoti. But can also enter the spiritual worlds too, but once there can never fall down, so they claim. 

There is only one category of jiva-soul who has "two-sides" to their individual personality.

The jiva¹-souls can be either nitya-siddha (eternally liberated) or nitya-baddha (etern¹+ally conditioned) 

The jiva-soul's original position is Nitya-siddha (eternally liberated)

This means the jiva-soul's original home is Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana.

Srila Prabhupada - "In the broader sense everyone comes from Krsnaloka (Goloka-Vrindavana). When one forgets Krsna he is conditioned (nitya-baddha), when one remembers Krsna he is liberated (nitya-siddha)." (Letter to Mukunda, June 10, 1969)

As said above, there is only one category of the jiva-soul who can be either nitya-baddha (eternally conditioned) or nitya-siddha (eternally liberated) 

To make it clear, only one kind of jiva-soul exists and due to free will,  they can choose to be either nitya-siddha or nitya-baddha.

The actual constitutional position of EVERY marginal living entity (jiva-soul) is Nitya-Siddha.

Srila Prabhupada - "There are "two-kinds" of marginal living entities, one being nitya-siddha and the other is nitya-baddha. The actual constitutional position of every marginal living entity is Nitya-siddha." (CC lecture, July 13, 1976) 

Srila Prabhupada - "By following the rules and regulations and instructions of the spiritual master, he can become again nitya-siddha. So the Krsna consciousness movement is to make the nitya-baddhas AGAIN nitya-siddha." (New York City Lecture CC, July 13, 1976).^^^.









No comments:

Post a Comment

Note: Only a member of this blog may post a comment.