Krsna promises there is no return to the material world once the jiva-soul is in the spiritual world, is this true?

In Bhagavad Gita As It Is, Krsna promises there is no return to the material world once in the spiritual world, but ONLY if the jiva-souls returning to the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka-Vrindavana ALSO agree with Krsna. 

In other words, Srila Prabhupada tells us there IS return if the jiva-souls wants to return, explaining it will always be voluntary to return to the material world or stay in the spiritual world otherwise free will has no meaning. 

This is because "free will" is also applied to Krsna's promise, which means the jiva-souls can choose to accept that promise by Krsna or reject it. 

Krsna will always promise to protect the jiva-souls He directs back home back to Godhead and say they will never again fall down to the material world, but it is also up to the jiva-souls to choose for themselves to either accept or reject that promise from Krsna too.

For example, yes we know Krsna will never break His promise, but try to understand that loving exchanges and relationships are a "two-way" street, meaning you always have a choice, you never lose that free will in Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana. 

Krsna offers His promise to the fallen jiva-souls but it is up to them to accept or reject that promise Prabhupada explains.

This means there is always free will even in choosing to accept or reject Krsna's promise because without having that free will we are no better than dead stone.

Therefore, even though Krsna has promised there is no return to the material creation once returning to the spiritual worlds, the fact is there is return if the jiva-souls want to return as Prabhupada explains here-

Acyutananda – "In Bhagavad Gita Krsna says, once coming to the spiritual world, the jiva-soul never returns to the material world, so He can return?"

Srila Prabhupada – "If he likes he can return, that is voluntary."

Guru-kripa – "How is it that one can become envious of Krsna?"

Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence, you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God. God has got full independence, but you have got independence too, proportionately, because you are part and parcel, so if he likes, he can return. That independence has to be accepted. We can misuse that. Krsna-bahirmukha haïä bhoga väïchä kare. That misuse is the cause of our falldown." (Mayapur February 19, 1976)

Devotee - "Well, I believe you once said that once a conditioned soul becomes perfected and gets out of the material world and he goes to Krsnaloka, there’s no possibility of falling back there."

Srila Prabhupada - "No! There is possibility, but he does not come IF he is intelligent. Just like after putting your hand in the fire, you never put it in again. So those who are going back to Godhead, they must become intelligent. Why going back to Godhead?" (Talk with Syamasundara Dasa)

Note - Prabhupada says above, "IF he is intelligent," indicating there will be some who are NOT intelligent and again will fall down to the material world.

So, clearly those who believe no one can ever fall down from Vaikuntha have not understood the variety of living entities in Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana, who most of them are Krsna's direct expansions and NOT jiva-tattva (jiva-soul)

The spiritual world is the manifestation of the Lord's internal potency, and the material world is the manifestation of His external potency. 

The living entities (jiva-souls) are also His marginal potency, and by their own choice they can live in either the spiritual or material worlds.

Only the marginal living entities (jiva-souls) are separate individuals who can express themselves in "separate-way" from Krsna, including disagreeing with Him if they choose, which means they have free will.

As said above, the Visnu-tattva personalities and Visnu-"sakti"-tattvas ARE Krsna just playing unlimited roles in Krsna's own pastimes.

An example of Visnu"sakti"-tattva is Mother Yasoda, she is NOT a jiva-soul, she is a direct expansion of Krsna. 

In other words, just like Krsna is also Balarāma, and Radharani is also Krsna but in a different mood, Mother Yasoda is also an expansion of Krsna.

Srila Prabhupada - "Nanda and mother Yasoda are the eternal father & mother of Krsna. This means that whenever Krsna descends, Nanda and Yasoda, as well as Vasudeva and Devaki, also descend as the Lord's father and mother. Their personalities are expansions of Krsna's personal body." (SB, Canto 10.8.48)

There are no new jiva-souls being created by Krsna, Maha-Visnu, or the impersonal brahmajyoti. 

Srila Prabhupada – "There are no new souls, new and old are due to this material body, but the jiva-soul is never born and never dies, so if there is no birth, how can there be new souls?" (Letter to Jagadisa dasa, 7/9/1970)

Bhagavad Gita As It Is Chapter 2 text 20 explains the jiva-souls have existed for “infinity”

This means, just like Krsna, they are beginning less and endless, and were NEVER created-

Bhagavad Gita - “For the soul there is neither birth nor death at any time. He has not come into being, does not come into being, and will not come into being. He is unborn, eternal, ever-existing and primeval. He is not slain when the body is slain.” (BG, Ch 2 text 20 “corrected” 1983 edition)

Bhagavad Gita As It Is Chapter 2 text 12 also confirms the jiva-souls were NEVER created because they have no origin and have existed for infinity like Krsna has, as Krsna explains-

Bhagavad Gita - “Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor in the future shall any of us cease to be.” (BG 2.12)

Being "marginal" means having the choice to be influenced by the spiritual energy or the material energy-

1 - The jiva-souls nature position and full potential in the spiritual world is always being connected to the spiritual energy.

2 - Or by the material energy which is an unnatural or incompatible "conditioned state" the jiva-soul is in.

As said above, the real meaning of "marginal" means the jiva-souls can choose to be influenced by either the spiritual energy, or the material energy, based on the expression of their free will.

It is only of the marginal living entities (jiva-souls) who can fall down, and NOT Kṛṣṇa's direct internal energy who are His eternal associates that always accompany Him. 

And even with the jiva-souls who express their free will, very few of them also choose to leave the spiritual world Prabhupada explains.

Srila Prabhupada has explained there will ALWAYS be a very small minority of only the "jiva-souls," less than 10%.

Dr. John Mize – "Did all the jiva-souls that were in the spiritual sky (the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka Vrindavan) fall out of the spiritual sky at once or at different times, or are there any jiva-souls that are always good, they’re not foolish, they don’t fall down?"

Srila Prabhupada – "No, there are majority, 90%, they are always good. They never fall down."

Dr. John Mize – "So we’re among the 10%."

Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, or less than that. In the material, whole material world all the living entities they are… Just like in the prison house, there is some population, but they are not majority. The majority of the population, they are outside the prison house. Similarly, majority of living being, part and parcel of God, they are in the spiritual world. Only a few fall down."

Dr. John Mize – "Does Krsna know ahead of time that a jiva-soul is going to be foolish and fall?"

Srila Prabhupada – "Krsna? Yes, Krsna may know because He is omniscient."

Dr. John Mize – "Are more jiva-souls falling all the time?"

Srila Prabhupada – "Not all the time. But there is the tendency of fall down, not for all, but because there is independence. Everyone is not liking to misuse the independence. The same example, just like a government constructing a city and constructs also prison house because the government knows that somebody will be criminal. So their shelter must be also constructed. It is very easy to understand. Not that cent percent population will be criminal, but government knows that some of them will be. Otherwise why they construct prison house also? One may say, "Where is the criminal? You are constructing." Government knows, there will be criminal. So if the ordinary government can know, why God cannot know? Because there is tendency."

Dr. John Mize – "The origin of that tendency (to fall from Goloka) is?"

Srila Prabhupada – "Yes."

Dr. John Mize – "From where does that tendency come?"

Srila Prabhupada – "Tendency means the independence. So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that you cannot become fall down, that is not independence. That is force. Therefore Krsna says,yathecchasi tathä kuru. “Now you do whatever you like." (BG, As It Is. lecture, Mayapur, June 20, 1973)

Free will is eternal in the spiritual worlds and without having the choice to either forget or remember Krsna, then we would have no independent personality separate from Krsna's Personality and no ability to voluntarily offer love, we would be like dead stone. 

Srila Prabhupada - "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that you cannot fall down, that is not independence, that is force. Therefore Krsna says, yathecchasi tathä kuru. "Now you do whatever you like." (LA, June 23, 1975)

Therefore, returning back home back to Godhead is not necessarily permanent for the jiva-souls Prabhupada has explained above, that choice to stay with Krsna or go is also the jiva-soul's choice too, even when Krsna promises there is no return.

So, clearly it is not just a "one-way" decision that Krsna only makes, no, real loving exchanges can never exist in a one-sided affair because there is always free will. 

Krsna does not control the surrendered jiva-souls by force like a puppet master controls0p every movement of his puppets with the manipulations of strings.

The jiva-souls do not lose their free will in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana which means Krsna does not forcibly take control of the jiva-souls and deny them their free will, which is their natural constitutional right of voluntary self expression or individual contributions based on theirs own unique personality that is eternally independent from Krsna's Personality. 

Srila Prabhupada - "Krsna does not want to become a lover by force, from the point of revolver. ‘You love me, otherwise I shall kill you!’ That is not love; that is threatening. Love is reciprocal, voluntary, good exchange of feeling. Then there is love. Not by force; that is rape. Why one is called lover, another is called rape?" (July 8, 1976 in Washington, D.C.)

Srila Prabhupada - ''We have got the propensity to love. Love means somebody else. Love cannot be one or love cannot be executed by only one, there must be another one. I love somebody; swhatomebody loves me, there must be lover, there must be beloved, and the transaction, then love." (SB Canto 1 Ch 2 text 6, Delhi, Nov 12, 1973)

Srila Prabhupada - "Love means two, there must be two, the lover and the belove." (Lecture on BG Ch 9 text 2-5, New York, Nov 23, 1966)

Srila Prabhupāda – ''Unless there are two persons, where is the question of love? Love means two persons, then there is exchange, then there is love. I must deal with you open-hearted, you must deal with me open-hearted, then there is love. So if you want to love Kṛṣṇa, God, then these things must be there." (Aug 9, 1976, Tehran)

In Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana personal voluntary expressions of loving exchanges are always encouraged by Krsna in His relationship with the jiva-souls. This adds flavour, variety and mystery to their association with the Lord.

This means the Kingdom of God (Goloka-Vrindavana and Vaikuntha) are not a "one-sided" dominating impersonal domain devoid of free will or voluntary service.

Denying free will does not allow or encourage voluntary personal contributions (offerings) expressed in a two-way exchange, that can only expand, enrich and flavour one's eternal relationship with Krsna (God).

Loving service to Krsna and exchanges with Him cannot exist if there is only a one-sided affiliate of total supremacy or preeminence. 

The fact is genuine loving relations and service are based on free will which includes loving exhanges between two, and is never a one-sided dominating affair!

Having Free will confirms the jiva-souls are Krsna’s marginal energy and that all decision making is a "two-sided affair," that allows the jiva-souls to voluntarily express themselves by choosing for themselves how to serve Krsna, or even reject Krsna if they choose.

Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no free will, then you are a stone. The stone has no free will. You want to be stone? Then you must have free will. But don't misuse your free will. But don't try to become stone either. That is not life." (Aug 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)

Having free will always allows the jiva-souls to voluntarily choose their own unique contributions that they want to selflessly offer to Krsna in loving service, this is the real meaning of surrender. 

Without free will, loving voluntary exchanges and reciprocation as a contributing PERSON in one's relationship  with Krsna, is NOT possible

Loving relationships can only work in a "two-way" exchange based on reciprocation and loving selfless service by two sharing loving voluntary exchanges.

Paramahamsa - "But ultimately if we come to Krsna, there’s no return Krsna says?"

Srila Prabhupada - "There is return, that is voluntary, return is there."

Paramahamsa - "If we want."

Srila Prabhupada - "Yes."

Paramahamsa - "So we can come to the spiritual world and return?"

Srila Prabhupada - "Yes."

Paramahamsa -"Fall down?"

Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, as soon as we try, "Oh, this material world is very nice, yes, Krsna says, yes, you go and enjoy the material world, otherwise what is the meaning of free will? Every living entity has got a little free will. And Krsna is so kind, He gives him opportunity, "All right, you enjoy like this." Just like some of our students sometimes go away, again come back. It is free will. Just like one goes to the prisonhouse, not that government welcomes, "Come on. We have got prisonhouse. Come here, come here." He goes out of his free will; again comes out, again goes. Like that."

Paramahamsa - ''So our desire to enjoy, we achieve these material bodies; and our desire to achieve Krsna brings us to our natural position."

Srila Prabhupada - ''Yes." (Morning walk, May 13, 1973, LA)

Srila Prabhupada - "Unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)

The choice for the jiva-souls to leave Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavana is possible because Krsna allows a "two-way" relationship which means one can accept or reject Krsna if they choose, otherwise how could you claim you have a "two-way" relationship with Krsna?

Srila Prabhupada - "Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will, unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will."

Hayagriva - "A man may know better but still act wrongly."

Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, but that is free will He misuses his. Just like a thief, he knows that his stealing is bad but still he does it. That is free will. He cannot check his greediness, so in spite of his knowing that he is doing wrong thing—he will be punished, he knows; he has seen another thief, he was punished, he was put into prison— everything he knows, but still he steals. Why? Misuse of free will. Unless there is misuse of free will, there is no question of free will." (Talk about Rene Descartes with Hayagriva)

Syamasundara - "Can we predict that returning back home, back to Godhead will be permanent? Can we predict that? Just like many prisoners leave the prison, however, some do come back?"

Srila Prabhupada - "No, there is no permanent effect because we have got little independence. There is nothing permanent because you can misuse your independence at any time and leave when ever you choose."

Syamasundara - "So some come back to the material creation?"

Srila Prabhupada -"Yes, otherwise there is no meaning of independence. Independence means you can do this, you can do that. "All right. Whatever you like."

Devotee - "Then the jiva-soul is so many times falling down, again and again, so will he eventually permanently come back?"

Srila Prabhupada - "He has got independence, therefore there is always the possibility he can misuse his independence and fall down. That's why when a man is released from the prison house, that does not mean permanently because he can come back again, the general law is not to come back, but if he likes, he can come back, otherwise what is the meaning of independence? But naturally if one becomes free from the prison house, he should not return there again."(Discussions with Syamasundara about Henri Bergson)

For those who believe no one can ever fall down from Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana once there, have not understood these clear points explained by Srila Prabhupada.

So, no, it would not negate the essence of Goloka-Vrindavana if we can leave God's Kingdom at anytime we choose, otherwise there is no question of free will or having freedom Prabhupada explains above. 

This is because the real essence of the jiva-soul's character is their constitutional nature of having free will.

Entering spiritual life does not mean you have to "surrender" or give up your free will.

The choice to leave Goloka-Vrindavana or Vaikuntha or stay is always there because we have free will, Prabhupada explains that.

In 1978 in Mayapur I argued this point with two senior gurus from another spiritual group (sanga) and humbly explained to them they have not understood that "free will" is never lost in Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana "with only the jiva-souls (marginal living entities)," and is the real cause of fall down for the jiva-souls and not maya.

Of course, Krsna's direct associates and most of His family members, who are an unlimited member of personalities in the spiritual world, are NOT jiva-soul, therefore they NEVER fall down.

The spiritual world is the manifestation of the Lord's internal potency, and the material world is the manifestation of His external potency. 

The living entities (jiva-souls) are also His marginal potency, and by their own choice they can live in either the spiritual or material worlds.

Only the marginal living entities (jiva-souls) are separate individuals who can express themselves in "separate-way" from Krsna, including disageeing with Him if they choose, which means they have free will.

As said above, the unlimited  Visnu-tattva personalities and Visnu-"sakti"-tattvas in the spiritual sky ARE Krsna just playing unlimited roles in Krsna's own pastimes.

An example of Visnu"sakti"-tattva is Mother Yasoda, she is NOT a jiva-soul, she is a direct expansion of Krsna. 

In other words, just like Krsna is also Balarāma, and Radharani is also Krsna but in a different mood, Mother Yasoda is also an expansion of Krsna.

Srila Prabhupada - "Nanda and mother Yasoda are the eternal father & mother of Krsna. This means that whenever Krsna descends, Nanda and Yasoda, as well as Vasudeva and Devaki, also descend as the Lord's father and mother. Their personalities are expansions of Krsna's personal body." (SB, Canto 10.8.48)

I really could not understand why people were going to these men when we had Prabhupada.

There is always the voluntary expression of free will the jiva-souls have on the spiritual planets Prabhupada has told us.

For the jiva-souls to remain in Goloka-Vrindavana, the Vaikuntha planets, or entering the material world are all voluntary..*^*..