Saturday, July 17, 2021

The individual jiva-souls are known as the "marginal plane or potency," or marginal living entities.

This means they can choose to voluntarily interact with Kṛṣṇa with loving exchanges based on "free will" in the spiritual world, or choose to ignore Kṛṣṇa and enter the material world. 

The jiva-souls who choose to remain in the spiritual world, have one of five primary relationships with Krsna there.

Being "marginal" means the individual jiva-souls are influenced by either the spiritual energy, or the material energy.

Marginal therefore means the jiva-souls, who by nature are spiritual beings, are "in-between" the influence of the spiritual and material energy, with the added attribute of "free will."

All marginal living entities (jiva-souls) have their own exclusive unique relationship with Krsna, each are equally intimate in an exclusive relationship with Krsna (God) in His Kingdom in the spiritual world in an unlimited variety of pastimes.

In the spiritual world, ALL relationships with Krsna are "equally blissful to each other," just like one may like a carnation flower, while others may choose to like a rose flower.

Srila Prabhupada - “The jiva-soul's position in the spiritual world is always voluntary. Some devotees want to serve Krsna as flower; they become flower there. If I want that "As a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna," he becomes flower, voluntarily, and he can change his, from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (SB Canto 6 Ch 1 text 1-4 - Melb, Australia May 20, 1975)

The jiva-souls are known as Krsna's “marginal energy,” the marginal energy (jiva-souls) are individual living entities and NOT some place where the jiva-souls have originated from, no, the marginal potency or realm ARE the individual jiva-souls!

The word "marginal" simply means the jiva-souls are under the influence of the spiritual energy, or the material energy.  

The marginal realm or potency is NOT a place, as clearly said above the marginal potency ARE the individual jiva-souls.

Many misunderstanding this fact.

There is no origin to Krsna's marginal energy (an unlimited number of individual jiva-souls), who have existed just as long as Krsna has existed. 

The marginal platform means the "jiva-souls" or spirit souls, who naturally belong as individuals in the supreme spiritual energy with Krsna, are called "marginal living entities" because they can choose to be influenced by either the spiritual energy, or material energy eternally, explained as follows by Prabhupada.

Srila Prabhupada – “The jiva-souls are Krsna’s marginal energy. Marginal energy means the jiva-souls may be under the control of the spiritual energy, or they may be under the control of material energy. But when the jiva-souls are under the control of the material energy, that is their precarious condition, struggle for existence. And when they are under spiritual energy, that is their original position and life of freedom.” (Los Angeles, Nov 23, 1968)

Srila Prabhupada - "We (the jiva-souls) are marginal energy (jiva-souls) Marginal means sometimes internal, sometimes external. When we are under the internal energy, that is our normal life, and when we are under the external energy, that is our abnormal life. Therefore, we are called marginal energy (jiva-souls); we can be either this way or that way. But being qualitatively one with the purusa, our tendency is to remain in the internal energy. Being in the external energy is our artificial attempt." (Letter to Lilavati, Allston, Mass 25 April, 1969)

Srila Prabhupada - "The material energy, called as Maya, is also one of the multipotencies of the Lord, as much as we (the jiva-souls) are also marginal potency of the Lord. The living entities (jiva-souls) are described as superior energy than matter, when the superior energy is in contact with inferior energy, it becomes an incompatible situation. But when the supreme marginal potency (jiva-souls) are in contact with the spiritual potency, Hara, it becomes the happy, normal condition of the living entity." (The Happening Album, New York City, Dec 1966)

Srila Prabhupada - "You are also energy; you are marginal energy (jiva-soul) Marginal energy means you (the jiva-souls) may be under the control of the spiritual energy or you may be under the control of material energy—your marginal position. But when you are under the control of the material energy, that is your precarious condition, struggle for existence. And when you are under spiritual energy, that is your life of freedom." (Intro BG As It Is, Los Angeles, Nov 23, 1968)

Therefore, being “generated” from the marginal plane does not mean the jiva-souls “originated” from some so called place in the Brahmajyoti.

First of all, being "marginal" means having free will, or having the choice to be influenced by the spiritual energy (the jiva-souls nature position and full potential) or influenced by the material energy (unnatural conditioned state) 

As said above, the real meaning of "marginal" means the jiva-souls can choose to be influenced by either the spiritual energy, or the material energy based on their free will.

There is no origin to the individual jiva-souls, they are eternally parts and parcel of Krsna and just as old as Krsna.

Srila Prabhupada – “The jiva-souls are Krsna's marginal energy. Marginal energy means we can live either in this external energy or in the internal energy, in between. So at the present moment we are living in the external energy. But this external energy is also Kṛṣṇa's energies, God's energy. It is not different from Him. But the external energy means we are captivated by the external energy. But the external energy is not permanent. The internal energy is permanent. The spiritual world is permanent, and the jiva-souls are also permanent as Bhagavad Gita As It Is Chapter 2 text 20 (1983 edition) reveals.” (Lecture on BG 9.4 -Melb, Australia April 23, 1976)

Bhagavad Gita As It Is Chapter 2 text 20 explains the jiva-souls have existed for “infinity”

This means, just like Krsna, they are beginning less and endless, and were NEVER created-

Bhagavad Gita - “For the soul there is neither birth nor death at any time. He has not come into being, does not come into being, and will not come into being. He is unborn, eternal, ever-existing and primeval. He is not slain when the body is slain.” (BG, Ch 2 text 20 “corrected” 1983 edition)

Bhagavad Gita As It Is Chapter 2 text 12 also confirms the jiva-souls were NEVER created.

This is because they have no origin and have existed for infinity like Krsna has, as Krsna explains-

Bhagavad Gita - “Never was there a time when I did not exist, nor you, nor all these kings; nor in the future shall any of us cease to be.” (BG 2.12)

The jiva-souls and Kṛṣṇa have always existed.

Srila Prabhupada – “There are no new souls, new and old are due to this material body, but the jiva-soul is never born and never dies, so if there is no birth, how can there be new souls?” (Letter to Jagadisa dasa, 7/9/1970)

Loving voluntary relationships with Krsna one can choose number from one to five.

These five are-

1 - Neutrality, 

2 - Servitude, 

3 - Friendship, 

4 - Parental affection, 

5 - And conjugal love.

A devotee has a relationship with Krsna the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of ALL causes, in five different ways-

1. One may be a devotee in a passive (inactive) state;

2. One may be a devotee in an active state;

3. One may be a devotee as a friend;

4. One may be a devotee as a parent;

5. One may be a devotee as a conjugal lover.''

Srila Prabhupada explains these 5 relationships in detail in the Book "Nectar of Devotion."

A "PASSIVE" relationship (number one in above list) with Krsna in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana, is an almost "inactive" position the jiva-souls can CHOOSE according to their desires ("free will") such as-

A cloud in the sky,

The Sky 

A blade of grass, 

A tree,

A rock or stone,

A fence,

A chair or bench,

A flag pole and a flag

A roadway, 

A Chariot, etc

The point is, EVERYTHING is alive in Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana, unlike the mundane dead material creation.

This means EVERYTHING from the shoes on your feet, to the clothes you wear, are all individual jiva-souls who have shape shifted as that form because they have chosen to play that particular role in Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavana. This is called a "passive" relationship with Krsna.

Many jiva-souls choose to have that passive (inert, inactive or idle) relationship with Krsna but it is NEVER impersonal. 

This means they do not react visibly to something that might be expected of them, like outwardly manifesting emotions or feelings.

Like a blade of grass or a tree is only seen moving in the wind and outwardly showing no emotion or passion.

Even though "inwardly" the jiva-soul, as that blade of grass or tree, is ecstatically blissfully completely aware of Krsna’s personal presence, and Krsna is fully aware of those personalities as the the blade of grass, or as a tree, there for Krsna's pleasure.

Many jiva-souls are therefore passive living beings in Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavana that do not being involved in visible reactions or active participation.

They simply choose to exist for the pleasure of Krsna.

Everything is alive as individual personalities in Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana however, many jiva-souls are playing a passive inactive role in Krsna's Kingdom.

It is important NOT confuse a "passive relationships" in Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana with impersonal mundane "inactive nonsense oneness" of the Mayavadis.

The fact is, Krsna's abode is full of diversity where the jiva-souls can voluntarily express themselves in unlimited ways, engaging in an endless variety of pure devotional service for Krsna.

For example, from active service of being a Cow herd boy or cow, to inactive service like being a flag on top of a flag pole or being the flag pole. 

1 - Devotees in the mood of "neutrality" choose to witness and support Krsna’s pastimes by their presence as plants, animals, streams, and so on, as well as normally inanimate objects like houses—all of which are fully conscious and alive in Goloka Vrindavan.

2 - Devotees in the "service mood" choose to run errands for Krsna, pack His lunch, wash His clothes, and perform other acts of loving service for Him.

3 - Devotees in the "fraternal mood" choose to serve Krsna by being His friends. They are sometimes boastful, considering themselves equal to Krsna because they have no idea Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of ALL causes, nor do they care. 

In Krsna's company the cow herd boys and girls enjoy games in the beautiful country forest settings of Vṛndāvana.

4 - Devotees who choose to be in the "parental mood", see themselves as Krsna’s provider and protector. Krsna behaves with them like a dependent child. His mother cuddles Him, carefully prepares His meals, and thinks only of His protection. His father sees that He has all the comforts of a normal home.

5 - Devotees who choose to be in the "conjugal" (of whom many are also Visnu-tattva and NOT just jiva-souls) position, or romantic, mood offer service as Krsna’s girlfriends, relating with Him in the intimacy of lover and beloved.

These relationships with Krsna are also based on reciprocation and loving exchanges too, even if the jiva souls manifest themselves as a cloud in the sky, a bench for Krsna to sit on, or a plate for Krsna to eat off.

Just like we enjoy relationships with our families and society, so does Krsna.

However, all of His relationships are eternal in Goloka-Vrindavana with their "svarūpa spiritual form, and completely free of material contamination.

Each of Krsna’s jiva-soul devotees interacts with Him by their "free will" in one of the above five primary relationships with Krsna  but can also change their rasa if they choose and be what ever they want to be serving Krsna. 

All jiva-souls are equally intimate with Krsna because in the Spiritual World all relationships with Krsna are equally blissful, just like one may like a carnation flower while others like rose flower.

Only small minority of jiva-souls are not granted their full potential of free will because they choose to leave the Spiritual Worlds and enter the mundane restricted material creation.

In the material creation the jīva-souls are conditioned by the kind of material bodily vessel they have possessed.

There are 8 million 400 thousand species of material life that the fallen jiva-souls can enter.

Free will therefore is restricted to those jiva-souls who have chosen to enter the mundane material creation.

In the material creation all species of life are forced to act under the modes of material nature which are eating, sleeping, mating and defending.

Therefore almost all jiva-souls (except for a rare few in the human form) have no "free will" in the bodily conditioned state. They only act under the instincts of eating, sleeping, mating and defending.

As said above, even in the rare human form of material life there is a very little free will.

The human form is also controlled by the karmic reactions to one's pious and impious actions, therefore piety can help one start their search for spiritual knowledge if they get a good birth, but is not always the case.

Free will in its "full potential" IS only experienced in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana (The Kingdoms of God) so that meaningful voluntary loving exchanges with Krsna always exists.

If the jiva-souls had no "free will" in the Spiritual World, then they are no better than dead stone Prabhupada tells us.

Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no "free will", then you are a stone. The stone has no "free will". You want to be stone? Then you must have "free will!" But don't misuse your "free will". But don't try to become stone either. That is not life." (Aug 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)

Srila Prabhupada – “So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that is not independence, that is force.” (Los Angeles, June 23, 1975)

Srila Prabhupada - "Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will. Unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will."

Hayagriva - "A man may know better but still act wrongly."

Srila Prabhupada -"Yes, but that is "free will". He misuses his. Just like a thief, he knows that his stealing, it is bad, but still he does it. That is free will. He cannot check his greediness, so in spite of his knowing that he is doing wrong thing—he will be punished, he knows; he has seen another thief, he was punished, he was put into prison— everything he knows, but still he steals. Why? Misuse of free will. Unless there is misuse of free will, there is no question of free will." (Excerpt from: Philosophy Discussions Srila Prabhupada about Rene Descartes)

Bali Mardana - "An example of free will is someone can choose Kṛṣṇa or turn away? Is that an example of free will?"

Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes, because if you accept Kṛṣṇa, then you must follow what Kṛṣṇa says. If you don't follow Kṛṣṇa, then what is the use of talking of Kṛṣṇa? If he accepts Kṛṣṇa, he must abide by the injunction of Kṛṣṇa."(Morning Walk, Jan 22, 1974, Hawaii)

Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)

Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no free will, then you are a stone. The stone has no free will. You want to be stone? Then you must have free will! But don't misuse your free will. But don't try to become stone either. That is not life." (Aug 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)

The individual jiva-souls are independent separate living entities in the spiritual world who have their own unique personality and sense of self that is separate from Krsna's Personality, yet simultaneously dependent on Krsna as His eternal parts and parcels.

The reason why Krsna gives the jiva-souls their independence and "free will" is so they can voluntarily choose for themselves how to serve Him and contribute to the relationship in their own unique personal way.

This means the jiva-souls can always contribute their own unique offerings without any pressure or force from Krsna.

Real love or service can only exist when "free will" allows the jiva-souls to voluntarily participate in loving devotional exchanges and contribute to the relationship with Krsna and therefore expanding it.

Surrender to Krsna in the spiritual world does not mean giving up your free will and allowing Krsna to control your every actions, deeds, words and thoughts.

No, the jiva-souls in the spiritual world are NOT programmed mindless drones who only obey and never contribute to the relationship with Krsna in their own unique way by thinking for themselves the different ways to serve Krsna.

Only by having free will can genuine loving exchanges and reciprocation take place, and without free will the jiva-soul is no better than dead stone Prabhupada has warned us.

Krsna NEVER interferes with the "free will" of the jiva-souls because if He did and never allowed them to have their "freedom of expression" to make their own choices in the spiritual world, then that also would mean loving exchanges and voluntarily participation and reciprocating with Krsna would never exist.

If the jiva-souls are forced to worship Krsna or Visnu then that is NOT loving voluntary exchanges that personalism is bases on, it is lovess cold impersonalism.

This "impersonal" version of Krsna's abode in Goloka-Vrindavana or on the Vaikuntha planets mentioned above, where the jiva-souls are forced to surrender (abandon) their "free will" to Krsna, and then let Him take over their individual existence by doing all their thinking for them, as many nonsense sangas (religious cults) propagate, is dangerous IMPERSONALISM.

Srila Prabhupada - "Their impersonalist philosophy is "oneness." So how there be love with just one? Is it possible? Have you got any such experience that love means one? No. Love means two. There MUST be two, the lover and the beloved. Kṛṣṇa is already lover. He loves you so much that He's trying to get you back. That is Kṛṣṇa's attempt. "Please, My dear boy, or My dear friend, My dear servant..." (Lecture on SB Canto 2 Ch 1 text 3, Paris, June 12, 1974)

Srila Prabhupada - "We have got the propensity to love. Love means somebody else. Love cannot be one or love cannot be executed only one, personally. There must be another one. I love somebody; somebody loves me, there must be lover, there must be beloved, and the transaction, then love." (Lecture on SB, Canto 1 Ch 2 text 6, Delhi, Nov 12, 1973)

Srila Prabhupada - "Love means you take and you give also. Suppose if you love somebody and you simply take from him, but you don't give. Oh, do you think it is very good? No. It is not good. That is NOT love. That is exploitation. If I go on simply taking from you, and if I don't offer you anything, that is simply exploitation." (Lecture on BG, Ch 9 text 2-5, New York City, Nov 23, 1966)

Srila Prabhupāda – "Unless there are two persons, where is the question of love? Love means two persons, then there is exchange, then there is love. I must deal with you open-hearted, you must deal with me open-hearted, then there is love. So if you want to love Kṛṣṇa, God, then these things must be there." (Aug 9, 1976, Tehran)

Having "free will" allows the jiva-souls to be the individual independent PERSON they are eternally in God's perpetual Kingdom, where they always choose to voluntarily contribute their own personal unique offerings to Krsna.

This is the real Goloka-Vrindavana and Vaikuntha planets which is the permanent eternal home of the marginal living entities (jiva-souls).

Srila Prabhupada - "So if by free will you choose to surrender to Krsna then you’ll get your real free will, real freedom, otherwise you are under the clutches of maya." (Morning Walk – 14 July 14, 1975, Philadelphia)

The jiva-souls in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana are forever voluntarily expanding the expression of their unique individuality with an increasing variety of personal devotional offerings based on free will, it is NEVER a nonsense one-sided master/slave mindless impersonal relationship with Krsna as Prabhupada explains.

Srila Prabhupada – "Love is reciprocal, voluntary, good exchange of feeling. Then there is love. Not by force, no, Krsna does not want to become a lover like that, ‘You love me, otherwise I shall kill you!" (Washington DC July 8, 1976)

Many, in fact most, do not understand what the spiritual world's of the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka-Vrindavana really are, and the many points supporting PERSONALISM explained here.

The "free will" to feel envy means you want to enjoy like Krsna and be in the centre instead of Krsna, such self centred desires immediately disqualifies you to remain in the spiritual world (Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana) and immediately you a transferred to the material creation managed by Maha-Visnu. 

Your spiritual memories are in the spiritual world and you cannot take them with you to the material world because they are NOT material.

Once the jiva-souls enter the material world, their free will is almost non-existent, and instead are directed by the demands of the material senses - eating, sleeping, mating and defending, found controlling all species of material life.

Therefore, there is no choice in the spiritual world influenced by "matter" or "maya" because matter (maya) does NOT exist in the spiritual world.

Also, maya is NOT the cause of the jiva-souls fall down from the spiritual world to the material world, "free will" is the cause of fall down, and that means there is always a choice that some nonsense sangas and their gurus cannot understand.

The jiva-souls can only enter the material world in a material bodily vessel provided by Maha-Visnu, and NOT as their spiritual eternal bodily form.

All knowledge of Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana is in the spiritual body, but now covered because one has entered the material world and is now covered by a temporary decaying material bodily vessel.

In the spiritual world, as their original spiritual bodily form, all jiva-souls are female in their intimate original relationship with Krsna. 

Yes, we are all female.

Not to confused with mundane transgender in the material world because if one is given a material bodily vessel of either a male or female, then that life is who they are in that life. In their next life, one can be either male, female, dog, Cow, tree - all material life forms have a jiva-soul.

However, in the spiritual world, even though one is originally female, they can appear as male, a cow, a tree, a bird, a street sign, a blade of grass, anything they like to serve Krsna.

Srila Prabhupāda - "There is form, just like this material body is compared with the dress. Now, just like in your present material form you have got hand; therefore your coat has got hand. You have got legs; therefore your pant has got legs. Therefore it is to be assumed that the spirit soul always has got form, and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. The spirit soul is not formless; it has got form. But with our material eyes at the present, gross eyes, we cannot find it; therefore we say and foolishly believe it has no form." (Lecture BG 2.14, Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)

Devotee – "Is the original body of the spirit soul a human form?" 

Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, human form, God is also human form. "Man is made after the shape of God." I think there is in the Bible. Is it not? So God is also like human form. Here you see Krsna, two hands, two legs."

Hari-sauri – "How do we understand, then, that there are peacocks and flowers and trees in the spiritual world? Are these not eternal forms?"

Srila Prabhupada – "[describing material form first]: Yes, they are more covered. Just like if you cover your body with blanket, the hands and legs are invisible. But you are not the blanket. So the trees and plants, they are more covered. They are not in full manifestation. The human form is the full manifestation of the soul."

Hari-sauri - "They are covered in the spiritual world?"

Srila Prabhupada - "Not in the spiritual world. There that is voluntary. Some devotee wants to serve Krsna as flower; they become flower there. If I want to be a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna, he becomes flower, voluntarily, and he can change his, from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (SB Canto 6 Ch 1 text 1-4 - Melb, May 20, 1975)

Srila Prabhupada - "The spirit soul is NOT formless; it has got form, the spirit soul always has form and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. But with our material eyes at the present, our gross eyes, we cannot see these facts; therefore we foolishly believe the jiva-souls have no form." (Lecture on BG 2.14 - Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)

Devotee - "What is the form of the spiritual body. If the spirit soul is non-material, what is the form?"

Srila Prabhupāda - "There is form, just like this material body is compared with the dress. Now, just like in your present material form you have got hand; therefore your coat has got hand. You have got legs; therefore your pant has got legs. Therefore it is to be assumed that the spirit soul always has got form, and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. The spirit soul is not formless; it has got form. But with our material eyes at the present, gross eyes, we cannot find it; therefore we say and foolishly believe it has no form." (Lecture BG 2.14, Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)

Srila Prabhupada - "Your question about one's relationship with Lord Krsna on Krsnaloka, does he ever fall down? The jiva-souls are endowed with minute independence as part of their nature and this minute independence may be utilized rightly or wrongly at anytime, so there is always a chance of falling down by misuse of one’s independence." (Letter to Jagadisa dasa, 4/25/1970)

Srila Prabhupada - "In the broader sense, everyone comes from Krsnaloka (Goloka-Vrindavana). When one forgets Krsna, he is conditioned (nitya-baddha), when one remembers Krsna he is liberated (nitya-siddha)." (Letter to Mukunda, June 10, 1969).**.
























2 comments:

  1. The jiva souls in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana are forever voluntarily expanding the expression of their individuality with an increasing variety of personal devotional offerings based on free will, it is NEVER a one sided master/slave none contributing mindless relationship with God as Prabhupada explains.

    Srila Prabhupada – "Love is reciprocal, voluntary, good exchange of feeling. Then there is love. Not by force, no, Krishna does not want to become a lover like that, ‘You love me, otherwise I shall kill you!" (Washington DC July 8, 1976)

    Real love or Bhakti is reciprocal, it is NEVER a one way street where surrender to Krishna takes away one's sense of self, individuality and personal loving contributions or voluntary offering.

    Each individual jiva-soul has their own independent personality (yet dependent on Krishna), separate from Krishna's Personality, which means having their own sense of self, and a "unique identity" that THEY only individually have.

    These attributes are part and parcel of each individual marginal living entity (jiva soul) making each of them the unique "PERSON" they eternally are.

    "Free will" in its full potential, is ONLY fully experienced in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavan, which is the jiva souls original perpetual home.

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  2. Being an eternal PERSON means having free will, Krishna does not want to be surrounded by mindless drones who have no individual offerings to contribute by choice that expands the relationship of loving exchanges.

    If one sannyasi from the 1970s who wrongly preached you must give up (surrender) your free will to enter Vaikuntha was still alive today he would know that such voluntary loving exchanges is only possible when the jiva soul has free will.

    Back in the late 60s, 70s and 80s many devotees never properly studied Prabhupada's Books and teachings, many believed, including some sannyāsis of those early pioneering years, surrender was giving up your free will. Most of them have gone today.

    Many back then foolishly believed extinguishing your individuality and free will was the real meaning of surrender, demanding you "hand over your individuality and free will and let Krishna shine through you and control you like a puppet master controls a puppet"

    Many of the early devotees were just hippies from the 60s who actually believed surrender means handing over your "free will" and let Krishna take over and work through you.

    Real surrender is to use your free will to choose how to serve Krishna better and better, not give it up

    Such nonsense bogus surrender of attempting to give up free will in the name of "surrender" is impersonalism, and destroys who you really are as a unique individual PERSON who can contribute as that person and not as some mindless devotee drone in a collective.

    Love is NEVER a "one way street", you MUST have your free will too, to make it a "two way" exchange of voluntary exchanges.

    Read the main article above clearly especially Prabhupada's quotes on free will.

    Our Prabhupada clearly says without "free will" you are no better than DEAD stone, to give up free will is impersonalism.

    To use your "free will" to think of ways to expand your loving exchanges with Krishna is personalism.

    Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no free will, then you are a stone. The stone has no free will. You want to be stone? Then you MUST have free will! But don't misuse your free will. But don't try to become stone either. That is not life". (August 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)

    Sadly in ISKCON today exists a very subtle expression of impersonalism, remember the jiva soul is a personalist - a PERSON and to be a personalist you MUST have "free will", otherwise you are just a mindless programmed drone in a collective like a robot machine in a factory."^^

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