It is very important to understand that the individual jiva-souls are eternal persons each with their own unique bodily form that can change voluntarily in the spiritual world according to Krsna's pastime.
This means each individual jiva-soul (marginal living entity) has their own personality separate from Krsna's Personality, and the free will to make their own decisions to stay in Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana, or leave.
The eternal spiritual bodily form is anti-matter (spiritual energy as an individual PERSONS as a spiritual bodily form)
sat,
cit,
ananda,
vigraha.
These word's means-
eternity,
knowledge,
bliss,
form.
Over 90% of eternal individual jiva-souls choose to stay in the spiritual world even though they can choose to leave if they want at ant time. In fact almost 10% do choose to leave and enter the material world via the dreams of Maha-Visnu.
The individual jiva-soul's voluntary contributions and full potential are eternally expressed fully in both Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana.
In the spiritual worlds the jiva-souls are never forced to surrender to Krsna or do anything they choose not to do, all service there is voluntary.
For loving service to truly exist, the individual jiva-souls (marginal living entities) must be able to voluntarily express themselves with their own contributions by making their own choices, their own decisions, even if it means rejecting Krsna, otherwise there can be no question of free will or being able to voluntarily express themselves as an individual and experience loving exchanges in a two-way relationship."
This quality of free will is part and parcel of every jiva-soul's marginal constitution that allows them to be an independent contributor that expands one's service to Krsna.
The eternal marginal living entities (jiva-souls) always have their free will or freedom of voluntary expression, this quality of free will is always included when describing the attributes of the individual jiva-souls.
As said above, Krsna allows this freedom because without voluntary loving exchanges, personal offerings within a two-way reciprocal relationship, then love could never exist.
Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence therefore you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God you have got independence, proportionately, therefore if he likes he can return to the material atmosphere. That independence has to be accepted, little independence. We can misuse that." (Mayapur, Feb 19, 1976)
Having free will is the constitutional make up of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls) that is eternally part and parcel of their individual character and personality in the spiritual world's of the Vaikuṇṭha planets and Goloka Vrindavana.
This includes at anytime the jiva-souls can choose to leave the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka-Vrindavana if they desire. It is nonsense to claim the jiva-souls can never fall down to the material world once in the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka-Vrindavana, having free will means they always have a choice without the independent quality of voluntary choices (free will), there is no question of loving exchanges.
So the choice to even leave Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavana is possible because Krsna allows a "two-way" relationship where one can accept or reject Krsna if they choose.
Srila Prabhupada - "Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will, unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will."
Hayagriva dasa - "A man may know better but still act wrongly."
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, but that is free will He misuses his. Just like a thief, he knows that his stealing is bad but still he does it. That is free will. He cannot check his greediness, so in spite of his knowing that he is doing wrong thing—he will be punished, he knows; he has seen another thief, he was punished, he was put into prison— everything he knows, but still he steals. Why? Misuse of free will. Unless there is misuse of free will, there is no question of free will." (Talk on Rene Descartes philosophy)
Also, there is only one classification of jiva-souls, not two as some believe, each individual jiva-soul can be either nitya-siddha (liberated in the spiritual world) or nitya-baddha (conditioned in the material world or inactive in the impersonal brahmajyoti)
In this way the jiva-souls can choose for themselves to be with Krsna, or reject Krsna. This is because each individual jiva-soul, as part of their spiritual constitutional make-up, always have free will.
Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)
Srila Prabhupada – "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that is not independence; that is force." (Los Angeles, June 23, 1975)
Some wrongly claim there are two types of individual jiva-souls-
1 - One who stays on the Vaikuṇṭha planets and Goloka Vṛndāvana and never fall down to the material world (nitya-siddha)
2 - And the other in the material world (nitya-baddha) who can also be dormant (inactive) in the impersonal Brahmajyoti. But can only enter the spiritual world from the material world, and once there can never fall down, so they claim.
As said above, there is only one category of jiva-soul who has two-sides to their individual personality, they can be nitya-siddha (liberated in the spiritual world) or nitya-baddha (conditioned in the material world, or inactive in the impersonal brahmajyoti)
The jiva-soul's original position is nitya-siddha (eternally liberated in the spiritual world) the jiva-soul's natural infinite home.
Srila Prabhupada - "In the broader sense everyone comes from Krsnaloka (Goloka-Vrindavana). When one forgets Krsna he is conditioned (nitya-baddha), when one remembers Krsna he is liberated (nitya-siddha)." (Letter to Mukunda, June 10, 1969)
Srila Prabhupada – "The answer to your question about the marginal energy is that the jiva-soul is always called the marginal energy whether he is in the spiritual world or in the material world." (Letter to Rayarama, Dec 2, 1968)
Srila Prabhupada - "There are two kinds of marginal living entities: nitya-siddha and nitya-baddha, the actual constitutional position of every marginal living entity is nitya-siddha." (CC, New York City lecture, July 13, 1976)
Srila Prabhupada - "By following the rules and regulations and instructions of the spiritual master, he can become again nitya-siddha. So the Krsna consciousness movement is to make the nitya-baddhas AGAIN nitya-siddha." (New York Lecture City, CC, July 13, 1976)
Srila Prabhupada - "So the Krsna consciousness movement is to make the nitya-baddhas (conditioned in the temporary material world) AGAIN nitya-siddha (eternally liberated in their real eternal home on the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka-Vrindavana), to bring them to their original position. It is a difficult task." (New York City Lecture, CC, July 13, 1976)
Srila Prabhupada - "Nitya-baddhas are within this material world. Beginning from Brahma down to a small ant, insignificant ant, they are all nitya-baddha. Anyone who is in this material world they are nitya baddha." (Lecture BG, July 14, 1973)
Srila Prabhupada - "We cannot say therefore that we are not with Krsna. As soon as we try to become Lord, immediately Maya covers us. Formerly we were with Krsna in His lila or sport. But this covering of Maya may be of very, very, very, very long duration; therefore many creations are coming and going." (Letter to Madhudvisa Swami June 1972 Australia)
Srila Prabhupada – ''Regarding your questions about how and from where did the conditioned souls fall, your first question if someone has a relationship with Lord Krsna on Krsnaloka (Goloka Vrindavana), does he ever fall down? The souls are endowed with minute independence as part of their nature and this minute independence may be utilized rightly or wrongly at anytime, so there is always a chance of falling down by misuse of one’s independence." (Letter to Jagadisa dasa 25 April 1970)
Srila Prabhupada – "These spirit souls and all spirit souls are coming from Vaikuntha, but in these material worlds they are taking various grades of bodies according to their material activities. There is no new souls. New and old are due to this material body, but the soul is never born and never dies, so if there is no birth how there can be new soul." (Letter to Jagadisa dasa 9 July 1970)
Srila Prabhupada - "Regarding your questions concerning the spirit souls falling into Maya’s influence, it is not that those who have developed a passive relationship with Krsna are more likely to fall into nescient activities. Usually anyone who has developed his relationship with Krsna does not fall down in any circumstance, but because the independence is always there, the soul may fall down from any position or any relationship by misusing his independence." (Letter to Jagadisa 27 Feb 1970)
Srila Prabhupada - "But his relationship with Krsna is never lost, simply forgotten by the influence of maya, but it can be regained or revived by the process of hearing the Holy Name of Krsna and then the devotee engages himself in the service of the Lord which is his original constitutional position. The relationship of the living entity with Krsna is eternal as both Krsna and the living entity are eternal; the process is one of revival only, nothing new." (Letter to Jagadisa dasa 27 Feb 1970)
Krsna (God) is more inclined to help those who first voluntarily do everything they can to help themselves by finding a "bonafide" spiritual master to teach them spiritual life.
If one is honest with themselves, Krsna sends the Guru (spiritual teacher) who will guide them out of the material creation and return back home, back to Godhead to be with Krsna.
Only then will Krsna help you when He sees you are trying your very hardest to do everything you can to help yourself, only then will Krsna send you a spiritual teacher.
Srila Prabhupada - "In all the śāstras [scriptures] the guru is described to be as good as God, but the guru never says, ‘I am God.’ The disciple’s duty is to offer respect to the guru just as he offers respect to God, but the guru never thinks, ‘My disciples are offering me the same respect they offer to God; therefore I have become God.’ As soon as he thinks like this, he becomes a dog." (From the Book, Science of reealization)
Real loving exchanges are voluntary and reciprocal, it is never a "one-way street" where Krsna does all the the jiva-souls thinking and actions for them, that is NOT surrendering to Krsna, it is impersonalism, it is extinguishing one's individual identity and their voluntarily contributions that enrich one's relationship with Krsna.
This mindless type of surrender where fool bogus devotees of Kṛṣṇa tell you to surrender your free will, individual contributions and and intelligence, is spiritual suicide!
Surrender to Krsna's pure devotees does not mean you lose your free will, independence and individuality to be qualified to enter the spiritual world, no, such bogus surrender is impersonalism.
The marginal living entity (jiva-soul) has always had freedom (free will) therefore, there is no question of the marginal living entity ever not having free will because free will in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana is perpetually part and parcel of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls) make up.
The eternal individual marginal living entities (jiva-souls) originate perpetually from Goloka-Vrindavana as a spiritual bodily form, and not the Impersonal Brahman as Prabhupada teaches.
Originally all jiva-souls are nitya-siddha because they all come from Goloka-Vrindavana, only when they enter the material creation and the impersonal brahman do they then become nitya-baddha.
Therefore nitya-siddha can become a nitya-baddhas and nitya-baddhas can AGAIN become nitya-siddha.
No individual jiva-souls originates from the impersonal Brahmajyoti because they are beginningless and endless and have no origin.
Srila Prabhupada - "Existence in the impersonal brahman is also within the category of non-Krsna consciousness, those who are in the brahman effulgence (inactive) are also in the fallen condition, so there is no question of falling down from a fallen condition. When fall takes place, it means falling down from the non-fallen condition. The non-fallen condition is Krsna consciousness." (Letter to Revatinandana, Los Angeles 13 June, 1970)
Devotee – "When we are in the spiritual sky and serving Krsna, we have a perfect relationship with Krsna, what causes us to fall down in the material world, because we’re already serving Krsna?"
Srila Prabhupada – "Because you desire to fall down. Here it is explained that "Don’t fall down."
Devotee – "Srila Prabhupada, I can’t understand why we should have an impure desire when we are already serving."
Srila Prabhupada – "Because you have got little freedom. Why one is not coming here and going to the liquor shop? It is desire."
Devotee – "In the Srimad-Bhagavatam, it says that Krsna did not want us to come to this material world. If Krsna did not want us to come, why are we here?"
Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, you forced Krsna to allow you to come. Just like sometimes a child forces his father. Father says, "My dear son, do not do this. Do not go there." But he insists, Oh, I must go. I must go." "All right, you go at your risk. That’s all. And you suffer. What can be done?" Because you are Son of God you have got independence, full independence, almighty—therefore you have acquired the quality of your father. You have got little independence. So God does not interfere with your little independence. If you persist that "I must go and enjoy independently," so God says, "All right, you can go." This is the position. You have to take sanction. That is a fact. But when you persist, God sanctions. And you come and enjoy." (Melb, Australia June 25, 1974)
Question - Is there a place in the spiritual world from where we can never fall down from?"
Answer - No, it is not based on a place where you can never fall down from that keeps you in Vaikuntha, it does not work that way because of free will, which means there is always choice. If you had no fee will then how can there be love?
The choice to leave or stay must always be with the individual jiva-souls otherwise free will has no meaning.
So many who consider themselves advanced devotees of God cannot understand what free will really means, they sentimentally claim "not even the leaves can fall down from Vaikuntha."
It is nonsense to claim the jiva-souls can ever again fall down from Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana because each individual jiva-soul has their own unique free will and can make their own decisions whether Krsna likes them or not, otherwise what is the point of having free will if I enter the spiritual world to never again fall down to the material world.
Such so called gurus, sanyasis, vedic scholars and devotees are all silly sentimental fools if they believe once reaching Vaikuntha the jiva-souls never again fall down to the material world.
Remaining in Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana eternally is based on what the jiva-soul's want to do as a unique individual, it is their choice to say or go not Krsnas as explained above otherwise there is no meaning to having free will.
If Krsna forced His will on the jiva-souls then He destroys their independence, free will and ability to voluntarily express themselves in their own unique way, allowing themselves to choose where they want to be even if returning to the material creation.
In other words, the jiva-souls also have a choice to become a servant of the Lord or can reject Him if they want, even in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana, only sentimental fools polluted by impersonalism cannot understand this.
The jiva-souls never lose their unique ability of free will and independent self expression, where one is personally always aware they can choose how to selflessly serve Krsna in their own unique way as the loving servant of the servant of Krsna.
The fact that one does not again fall from Krsna's personal Kingdom is the jiva-soul's responsibility too and not just only Krsnas.
It is the jiva-soul's choice as well, it is their free will to choose and no one else can choose for them including Krsna.
However, 90% of all jiva-souls do not fall down from Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavana because they choose not to.
That choice to stay in Vaikuntha or leave is always with the marginal living entities or jiva-souls.
The jiva-souls or marginal living entities have 78.125% of Krsna's quantities or 50 of Krsna's 64 attributes which puts them in the realm of having independence, identity, personality, individuality and the ability to choose. This means the jiva-souls have the ability to agree or not agree with Krsna.
Their individuality allows the jiva-souls the right to choose Krsna or choose to be separate from Krsna, this is the meaning of free will.
Remember, Maya and the material energy do not exist in Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana, so Maya is unknown to the jiva-souls in the spiritual worlds.
However, free will and independence allows the jiva-souls to experience a unique sense of individuality with the ability to express oneself in their own way.
All these qualities are the constitutional makeup of each jiva-soul in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana.
And if all those abilities are taken away, then the jiva-souls lose the ability to give and accept love and become no better than dead stone.
Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no ''free will, "then you are a stone. The stone has no "free will." Do you want to be stone? Then, you must have "free will!" But don't misuse your ''free will." But don't try to become stone either. That is not life." (Aug 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)
Srila Prabhupada - "Because you are Son of God you have got independence, full independence, almighty—therefore you have acquired the quality of your father. You have got little independence. So God does not interfere with your little independence." (Melb, Australia June 25, 1974)
No one forces the eternal individual jiva-souls to stay in Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana, that voluntary (choice). For loving exchanges and reciprocation to truly exist with the individual jiva-soul, they must be able to express themselves as the independent persons they are, and choose for themselves if they want leave the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka Vrindavana, therefore returning there is not necessarily permanent.
In the material world Krsna never interferes with the jiva-soul's desires, they can be truly on their own in the material world, or when dormant in the impersonal brahmajyoti.
Syamasundara dasa - "But can we predict that the process (returning back home back to Godhead) will be permanent? Can we predict that? Just like many prisoners."
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, otherwise there is no meaning of independence and free will. Independence means you can do this, you can do that. "All right. Whatever you like."
Devotee "Then he is so many times falling down, again and again, so will he eventually permanently come back?"
Srila Prabhupada - "No, there is no question of permanent because he has got independence, he can misuse his independence, he can fall down. That's why when a man is released from the prison house, that does not mean permanently because he can come back again, the general law is not to come back. but if he likes, he can come back, otherwise what is the meaning of independence? Just like one becomes free from the prison house, naturally he should not go there again." (Discussions with Syamasundara on Henri Bergson philosophy)
The eternal individual jiva-souls have 78.125% of Krsna's 64 qualities which means they have 50 of Krsna's 64 qualities.
The eternal individual jiva-souls are a separated and minor expansion of Krsna endowed with an individual identity with their own unique personality that allows them to experience an independent personal sense of reality separate from Krsna absolute control over the individual jiva-souls.
This allows the jiva-souls to make their own decisions and choices as the unique contributing PERSON they are eternally. Again, Krsna does not interfere with the individual jiva-soul's free will because "free will" is part of the eternal constitution of all jiva-souls.
Krsna never at any point, did not give freedom or free will to the individual marginal living entities (jiva-soul) because they have always had free will on the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka Vrindavana eternally
Free will allows the jiva-souls to experience individuality, loving reciprocation, independent service, and be responsible for their actions.
This however does not means all jiva-soul's are independent from Krsna's control of all things, that is not possible.
At all time the jiva-souls are always dependent on Krsna or His expansions, even as independent individuals because Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of all causes.
Therefore the jiva-souls always remain independent living entities, but always simultaneously depend on Krsna and His expansions in both the spiritual worlds and material worlds.
The jiva-souls are never fully independent because Krsna owns everything.
So, even though the jiva-souls are an expansion of Krsna, the jiva-souls are not one with Krsna in personality, the jiva-souls are also independent with their own unique personality.
As said above, the individual jiva-souls are not one with Krsna but are independent thinking marginal living entities with their own sense of independent self, personality and character that makes them one in purpose with Krsna an a unique individual PERSON eternally.
Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu is the manifestation of Radha and Krsna in one Body where both experience each other's love for each other.
Infact, Krsna, Balarama, Radharani and Lord Caitanya are all the one personality, are all Visnu-tattvas originating from Krsna.
However a small minority of jiva-soul's (independent souls who have 78.125% of Krsna's qualities which is have 50 of Krsna's 64 attributes) can choose to leave Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavan if they like, regardless of how some scholars, sages, devotees have interpreted Vedic texts like Srimad Bhagavatam (Bhagavat Purana).
Their claim that once reaching Vaikuntha the jiva-soul never fall down is not fully correct.
Therefore, to say those who enter Vaikuntha will never again fall down is only true for those who choose not to fall down.
In other words, if the eternal individual jiva-soul wants to leave they certainly can otherwise having free will has no meaning and Krsna's kingdom is a impersonalists paradise that needs to be rejected as bogus!
Going to the material worlds is ultimately the jiva-soul's choice and Krsna does not interfere, even though He has promised there is no return to the material creation once entering the Spiritual atmosphere.
The fact, there is return if the jiva-souls wants to return to the material creation Prabhupada tells us, it is their choice too.
Acyutananda – "But in the Bhagavad Gita it says, “Once coming to the spiritual abodes, he never returns to the material world, he can return?"
Srila Prabhupada – "If he likes he can return, that is voluntary."
Guru-kripa – "How is it that one can become envious of Krsna?"
Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence, you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God, God has got full independence, but you have got little independence, proportionately, because you are part and parcel, if he likes, he can return. That independence has to be accepted, little independence. We can misuse that. Krsna-bahirmukha haïä bhoga väïchä kare. That misuse is the cause of our falldown." (Conversation, Mayapur, Feb 19, 1976)
For those who believe no one can ever fall down from the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka-Vrindavana have not understood the variety of living entities in Vaikuntha of whom the individual jiva-souls are just one.
The majority of Krsna's internal potency (personnel) are His Visnu-tattva expansions.
Also, it is only a very small minority of jiva-souls who choose to leave and not in the category of Visnu-tattvas who never fall down because they are Krsna Himself playing another role in His own pastimes.
Many have not understood there are many different categories of living entities in Vrindavana who never fall down, such as the many categories of "sakti-tattvas" who are not all jiva-souls but Visnu-tattva personalities.
Many are direct expansions of Krsna with most of His qualities, like Visnu-tattva who have 93.75% of Krsna's qualities, which is having 60 of Krsna's 64 attributes).
Of course such Visnu-tattva expansions never fall down because they are Krsna experiencing Himself in another role, like in a play.
So for them, choice is exactly the same as Krsna's choice. And for over 90% of jiva-souls who have the ability to choose, they also never fall down because they choose not to fall down.
Devotee - "Well, I believe you once said that once a conditioned soul becomes perfected and gets out of the material world and he goes to Krsnaloka (Goloka-Vrindavana), there’s no possibility of falling down again?"
Srila Prabhupada - "No, there is possibility, but he does not come IF he is intelligent. Just like after putting your hand in the fire, you never put it in again if you are really intelligent. So those who are going back to Godhead, they become intelligent." (CC, Adi-lila 7.108 San Francisco, Feb 18, 1967)
However, there will always be a very small minority of only the jiva-souls who misuse their free will and leave Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana.
Free will is eternal in the spiritual worlds, without having the choice to either forget or remember Krsna, then we would have no independent personality separate from Krsna's Personality and no ability to voluntarily offer love, we would be like dead stone or machines in a factory.
The eternal constitution and original position of the marginal living entities (jiva-souls) is fully explained by Krsna disguised as a brahmana as follows-
The Brāhmaṇa said - "My dear friend, even though you cannot immediately recognize Me, can't you remember that in the past you had a very intimate friend? Unfortunately, you gave up My company and accepted a position as enjoyer of this material world." (SB, Canto 4 Ch 28 text 53)
Srila Prabhupada - "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that you cannot become fall down, that is not independence. That is force. Therefore Krsna says, yathecchasi tathä kuru. "Now you do whatever you like." (Los Angeles, June 23, 1975).×÷=.
No comments:
Post a Comment
Note: Only a member of this blog may post a comment.