Voluntary service in the Kingdom of God (Krsna) is only genuinely expressed in a "two-way" reciprocation of loving exchanges.
Krsna will ALWAYS sanction "free will," which means voluntarily using one's abilities to choose how they want to serve Kṛṣṇa.
Without free will, the jiva-souls can never participate in voluntarily expressing their unique love for Kṛṣṇa that enrich and expand the relationship by adding varigatedness.
The jiva-soul's (marginal living entities) relationship with Krsna, is naturally a "two-way" partnership that allows shared loving exchanges with Krsna based on reciprocation and voluntary cooperation.
Krsna gives the jiva-souls "free will" for the purpose to allow love to exist which means of allowing a "two-way" to participation by having loving exchanges.
Such loving exchanges can NEVER exist with just "one" making all the decisions, not even Krsna.
Love can only exist in a "two-way" exchange of intimate expressions. Only a "two-sided" cooperation expands one's unique individual voluntary contributions presented to Krsna as personal offerings.
In Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana, personal expressions of loving exchanges expressed by only having free will, are ALWAYS encouraged by Krsna in His relationship with the jiva-souls, that add flavour, variety and mystery to the association.
This means the Kingdom of God (Krsna's abode)) is NOT a "one-sided" dominating impersonal stagnant domain devoid of personal offerings (free will) that denies personal contributions (offerings) to God (Krsna), meant to expand, enrich and forever flavour the relationship with Kṛṣṇa with unlimited variety.
As said above, LOVE or service is NOT a "one-sided" affiliate of total supremacy or pre-eminence.
The fact is, genuine loving relations and service are based on voluntary reciprocal exchanges and contributions between TWO, not just one!
The individual jiva-souĺs have THEIR choices too, EVEN if that choice means rejecting Krsna!
Free will ONLY has meaning when the jiva-souls can express themselves in a "two-sided" voluntary affair.
In other words, loving reciprocation is ONLY possible in a "two-way" exchange between two individuals with each contributing to the relationship's expansion of nectarine mellows.
The word "reciprocation" only has meaning when there are TWO involved, not one!
This also means the individual jiva-souls CAN reject Krsna if they choose, which in a sense proves that "free will" DOES truly exist.
Srila Prabhupada - "Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will. Unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will." (Philosophy Discussions - Rene Descartes)
Srila Prabhupada – "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that you cannot become fall down, that is not independence. That is force." (Mayapur, June 20, 1973)
Having "free will" is the eternal constitutional make up of EVERY "marginal living entity (jiva-soul)," and is the foundation that begins ALL the jiva-soul's interactions with Krsna.
Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no free will, then you are a stone. The stone has no free will. You want to be stone? Then you must have free will!" (Aug 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)
Srila Prabhupāda – "Love means a relationship between "two-persons," then there is exchange, then there is love. I must deal with you open-hearted, you must deal with me open-hearted, then there is love. So if you want to love Kṛṣṇa, God, then these things must be there." (Aug 9, 1976, Tehran)
Srila Prabhupada - "Love means you take and you give also. Suppose if you love somebody and you simply take from him, but you don't give. Oh, do you think it is very good? No, it is not good. That is NOT love, that is exploitation. If I go on simply taking from you, and don't offer you anything in return, that is simply exploitation." (Lecture BG, Ch 9 text 2-5, New York City, Nov 23, 1966)
Srila Prabhupada - "We have got the propensity to love. Love means somebody else. Love cannot be one or love cannot be executed only by one, there must be another one. I love somebody; somebody loves me, there must be lover, there must be beloved, and the transaction, then there is love." (SB, Canto 1 Ch 2 text 6, Delhi, Nov 12, 1973)
Srila Prabhupada - "The impersonalist philosophy is oneness, so how there be love with just one? Is it possible? Have you got any such experience that love means one? No. Love means two. There MUST be two, the lover and the beloved. Kṛṣṇa is already lover. He loves you so much that He's trying to get you back. That is Kṛṣṇa's attempt. "Please, My dear boy, or My dear friend, My dear servant." (SB, Canto 2 Ch 1 text 3, Paris, June 12, 1974)
Srila Prabhupāda - "There is also form, just like this material body is compared with the dress. Now, just like in your present material form you have got hand; therefore your coat has got hand. You have got legs; therefore your pant has got legs. Therefore it is to be assumed that the spirit soul always has got form, and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. The spirit soul is not formless; it has got form. But with our material eyes at the present, gross eyes, we cannot find it; therefore we say and foolishly believe it has no form." (Lecture BG, Ch 2.14, Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)
Devotee – "Is the original body of the spirit soul a human form?"
Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, human form, God is also human form. "Man is made after the shape of God." I think there is in the Bible. Is it not? So God is also like human form. Here you see Krsna, two hands, two legs."
Hari-sauri – "How do we understand, then, that there are peacocks and flowers and trees in the spiritual world? Are these not eternal forms?"
Srila Prabhupada – "[describing material form first]: Yes, they are more covered. Just like if you cover your body with blanket, the hands and legs are invisible. But you are not the blanket. So the trees and plants, they are more covered. They are not in full manifestation. The human form is the full manifestation of the soul."
Hari-sauri - "They are covered in the spiritual world?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Not in the spiritual world. There that is voluntary. Some devotees want to serve Krsna as flower; so they become flower there. If I want that, to be a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna, then he become flower, voluntarily, and he can change his, from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (SB, Canto 6 Ch 1 text 1-4, Melbourne, May 20, 1975)
The full potential of the jiva-souls is bodily form always active in Krsna's pastimes and NOT some impersonal formless spark dormant or inactive in Krsna's Bodily effulgence (the impersonal aspect of the brahmajyoti)
Srila Prabhupada – “The human form is the full manifestation of the jiva-soul.” (Melb, Australia May 20, 1975)
Srila Prabhupada - "The spirit soul is NOT formless; it has got form, the spirit soul always has form and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. But with our material eyes at the present, our gross eyes, we cannot see these facts; therefore we foolishly believe the jiva-souls have no form." (Lecture on BG 2.14 - Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)
Devotee - "What is the form of the spiritual body. If the spirit soul is non-material, what is the form?"
Srila Prabhupāda - "There is form, just like this material body is compared with the dress. Now, just like in your present material form you have got hand; therefore your coat has got hand. You have got legs; therefore your pant has got legs. Therefore it is to be assumed that the spirit soul always has got form, and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. The spirit soul is not formless; it has got form. But with our material eyes at the present, gross eyes, we cannot find it; therefore we say and foolishly believe it has no form." (Lecture BG 2.14, Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)
Devotee - "Śrīla Prabhupāda, you state that spirit soul has form."
Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes."
Devotee - "Otherwise, how is the material body grown to accommodate the spirit soul? Just like a shirt has no form, but when it's put on the body, it takes the shapes of the body. Does that mean that the spirit soul has the shape of the body that is accommodating it?"
Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes, you have got body, a shape, very minute shape that we cannot see, we cannot measure. Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, "anumeyam," what is that word used? Aprameyam, you cannot measure but it has a form. What is the length and breadth of that form? That is not in your power, but it is not material. If you have spiritual power then you can measure it. And that measurement is also given in the śāstra. What is that? One ten-thousandth part of the tip of the hair. Hair is a very small point. And divide it into ten thousand parts. That one part is the measure, magnitude of the soul.
keśāgra-śata-bhāgasya
śatadhā kalpitasya ca
jīva-bhāgaḥ sa vijñeyaḥ
sa cānantyāya kalpate
(CC Madhya 19.140)
Everything is there. But you have no eyes to see, how to see one ten-thousandth portion of the top of the hair? You cannot see even the original top of the hair. Everything is there. We must have the proper eyes." (Lecture SB, Canto 1 Ch 16 text 24 - Hawaii, Jan 20, 1974)
Hayagrīva dasa - "Aquinas believed that God is the only single essence that consists of pure form. He felt that matter is only a potential and, in order to be real, must assume a certain shape or form.
"Being in the universe have to acquire an individual form in order to actualize themselves. When matter unites with form, the form gives an object its individuality and personality. A bodily form gives an object its individuality and personality."
Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes, the matter has no form. The spirit soul has got form. Though the matter is covering the actual form of the spirit soul, the matter appears to have form. Just like the original cloth has no form, but when the tailor cuts the cloth according to the body of the person, then the shirt and coat takes a form. The matter itself has no form. When you take clay, it has no form, but if you make it like a doll, like a man or woman, then it has a form. When the change the clay, and you manufacture a fort, then the fort has form. So form and formlessness is of the matter, but in the spiritual world everything has got form. The spirit soul has got form. God has got form. This is the truth."
Hayagrīva dasa - "Aquinas believed that only God and the angels have form that is not material. There is no difference between God's form and His spiritual self."
Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes, as in the material world any form-man or beast or anyone—in the outward, external covering is matter, but within the matter there is the soul. The soul has form and God has form. That is real form. And the material form is simply shirting and coating over the spiritual body." (Philosophy Discussion on Thomas Aquinas)
Hayagrīva dasa - "He considered that matter was necessary to give the soul form."
Srila Prabhupāda - "No, he has got his original form."
Hayagrīva dasa - "Original form?"
Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes."
Hayagrīva dasa - "Which is the form of the body."
Srila Prabhupāda - "Original form (like Krsna's Bodily, that is the form of the spirit."
Hayagrīva dasa - "Of the spirit."
Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes, and the form of the body takes place on account of the form of the spirit. This is very nice example. The cloth has no form, but when it is cut according to the form of the gentleman, it takes a form. Similarly, matter has no form. When it is coated on the spiritual form of the soul, it takes the form. This is very easy to understand." (Philosophy Discussion on Thomas Aquinas beliefs)
All the individual personal contributions offered by the surrendered jiva-souls, are forever coming from their expanding unique ability of self expression and constantly re-inventing themselves in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana.
This allows the jiva-souls to always make voluntary offerings to Krsna that forever increase and expand loving emotions in healthy "two-way" exchange between Kṛṣṇa and the individual jīva-souls.
It is VERY important to understand that the individual jiva-souls are "PERSONS" with their own unique individual actions of self expression expanding always in both Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana.
It must be clearly understood, for love to truly exist, each jiva-soul MUST have the free will to make their own choices, even if it means leaving Krsna if they choose, otherwise there can be no question of genuine loving service.
Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)
This quality or attribute of free will is part and parcel of the jiva-soul's marginal constitutional nature, as an independent free thinking part and parcel expansion of the Krsna.
Krsna allows this freedom for all jiva-souls have because without free will loving exchanges, voluntary contributions and reciprocation would NEVER exist.
Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence therefore you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God you have got independence, proportionately, therefore if he likes he can return. That independence has to be accepted, little independence. We CAN misuse that." (Mayapur, Feb 19, 1976)
As said above, having "free will" is the constitutional make up of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls) that is ALWAYS part and parcel of their character and personality in the spiritual world. This means the jiva-souls can even choose to leave the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka-Vrindavana if they want otherwise free will has no meaning.
"Free will" always allows this and if it didn't, then there is no question of loving exchanges or free will existing in Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana.
HERE HERE HERE HERE HERE
The choice to leave Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana is possible because Krsna allows a "two-way" relationship, this means one can accept or reject Krsna if they choose to do so and is proof the jiva-souls do have their free will in the spiritual world.
On the other hand in the mundane material creation there is almost no free will, so many terrible things are constantly happening and taken for granted due to ignorance.
Like the unnatural painful cycle of birth experienced trapped in a temporary material bodily vessel that is subject to disease, old age and death.
The jiva-souls experience this while covered by a temporary material bodily vessel they foolishly take for granted, due to forgetting they are eternal spiritual beings within the material body.
Frustration in the constantly changing material creation, will always be experienced by those jiva-souls (marginal living entities) who choose to leave Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana, and foolishly enter the material creation, because the material creation is ALWAYS in a constantly progressive state of decay, decline and forgetfulness.
Therefore one's material bodily vessel always wears out, breaks down and decays (dies)
But the jiva-soul, covered by the material temporary body, is eternal and therefore never subjected to decay or decline, but IS forced to continuously change bodies because of the temporary nature of the material creation.
The suffering of the individual jiva-soul within this temporary material nature, does NOT happen because of Krsna, He is not responsible for the jiva-soul's choices.
No, Krsna is NOT responsible for the suffering of the individual jiva-souls who have chosen to enter the material creation.
Even though the massive Brahmanda material universes, that our smaller secondary material universe is found within one of them, are all Krsna's creation. They are built by His expansion Maha-Visnu.
And then Garbhodakashayi Visnu, who builds a secondary universe inside the massive Brahmanda universe.
The suffering in the material creation happens because at one point in the spiritual world, the individual jiva-soul has "chosen" to misuse their "free will", given to them by Krsna for the purpose of allowing voluntary diversity meant to encourage individual devotional offerings and loving exchanges.
Therefore, as a result of mistakingly misusing their free will, the jiva-souls are forced by their own actions, to enter the temporary material creation and become entangled in the repeated cycle of birth and death.
The spherical material Brahmanda universal shells are all coming from Maha-Visnu as seen in painting.
Deep inside each Brahmanda is a secondary universe created by Garbhodakashayi Visnu, who is an expansion of Maha-Visnu.
From Garbhodakashayi Visnu Brahma is born who builds the many planetary systems within the inner material universe inside the Brahmanda as painting below reveals.
Krsna will NEVER interfere with the individual jiva-soul's free will because if he did, the jiva-souls would have no independent sense of self-expression, or the ability to accept and experience genuine loving exchanges and service.
Without having that independent sense of being a"unique individual," which means having personal individual attributes that allows one to "choose" for themselves how to voluntary be involved in loving exchanges of service with Krsna, contributing in their own way based on loving reciprocation, then there can be no question of genuine loving exchanges.
These are the characteristics that make the jiva-soul (marginal living entity) the individual PERSON they are eternally.
Love or service in the spiritual worlds is NEVER a "one-way" street, love can ONLY exist when "two" are exchanging loving feelings with each other.
Only then when there is loving reciprocation and exchanges of good feelings between Kṛṣṇa and His devotee, does love exist.
Only when "two" are voluntarily involved in reciprocating with each other can love exist.
In this way, real love or service is ALWAYS based on a "two-way exchange of feelings."
As said above, that means offering individual contributions that will enhance, expand and perpetually uplift the relationship between Krsna and His marginal living entities (jiva-souls).
This can ONLY exist if the jiva-souls are allowed to express their own independent individuality and unique free will without interference (forced surrender) from Krsna or His disciples.
If Krsna did force His will on the jiva-souls, then there can never be genuine loving exchanges because denying "free will" is also denying the jiva-souls voluntarily contributing their own choices of devotional service to Krsna.
Srila Prabhupāda - "Unless there are "two persons", where is the question of love? Love means two persons, then there is exchange. When these things are transacted, then there is love. I must deal with you open-hearted, you must deal with me open-hearted, then there is love. So if you want to love Kṛṣṇa, God, then these things MUST be there." (Evening Darsana, Aug 9, 1976, Tehran)
Srila Prabhupada - "Love is reciprocal, voluntary, good exchange of feeling. Then there is love. Not by force, no, Krsna does not want to become a lover like that, ‘You love me, otherwise I shall kill you!" (Washington DC July 8, 1976)
Having "free will" is the eternal constitutional make up of EVERY "marginal living entity", and is the foundation for ALL jiva-soul's voluntary relationship with Krsna.
Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no free will, then you are a stone. The stone has no free will. You want to be stone? Then you must have free will!" (Aug 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)
In the spiritual world or Kingdom of God (Goloka-Vrindavana), loving service can never be a one-way or one-sided affair, no, real love or service is always an exchange of voluntary loving exchanges between two in a two-way relationship.
Surrendering one's "free will" to Krsna so He has complete control over the jiva-soul's every thought and actions, just like a puppet master has absolute control over his puppets, to a Vaisnava, is dangerous impersonalism.
Srila Prabhupada - "In Bengali it is said, ‘If you catch one girl or boy, You love me, you love me, you love me, is it love? You love me, otherwise I will kill you! Is that love? So Krsna does not want to become a lover like that, on the point of revolver, you love me, otherwise I shall kill you! That is not love; that is threatening. Love is reciprocal, voluntary, good exchange of feeling. Then there is love. Not by force; that is rape. Why one is called lover, another is called rape?" (July 8, 1976 in Washington, D.C).
Such impersonalism is just like a puppet master controls his mindless puppet by moving the strings.
The puppet has no sense of life, freedom or independence, similarly if Krsna had full control over the individual jiva-soul's ability to make their own choices, it would deny the jiva-souls from experiencing their own personal sense of an independent self, and being able to make their OWN decisions and choices of offering their own personal unique contributions.
Sadly, this type of bogus surrender, where immature leaders demanded you surrender your free will and let Krsna flow through you and do all the thinking for you, was a serious problem in the early pioneering years (1960s and 70s) of understanding what genuine surrendering to Krsna (God) and His pure devotees really meant.
This kind of "mindless surrender" of being told to give up your free will, is actually impersonalism.
The fact is, if Krsna had full dictatorial control over the jiva-souls in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavan, then that one-sided relationship is only empty impersonalism, slaverly and devoid of real love.
Only a fool would want to be Krsna's mindless slave by attempting to extinguish your individuality, free will and independence thought that makes you a person who can choose to contribute to the relationship.
Such a nonsense "one-sided" dictatorial relationship in Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana, would simply make the jiva-souls no better than "mindless" lifeless dead stone Prabhupada has warned, just like a lifeless puppet controlled by strings!
Therefore the jiva-souls in Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavan, ALWAYS have their own independent "free will" that is part and parcel of their unique individual marginal identity (As jiva-soul)
This "freedom" of having free will, allows the jiva-souls to each make their own unique personal offerings and voluntary contributions to Visnu or Krsna, where each jiva-soul can offer or serve Krsna in their own unique personal way.
In other words, each individual jiva-soul has their own special unique (personal) association and relationship with Krsna that no other jiva-soul has like theirs.
These loving exchanges are based on a "two-way" relationship between Krsna and the jiva-souls.
However, in the temporary material creation, it is different because those who have entered the material creation have previously chosen to leave Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavan by rejecting Visnu in Vaikuntha or Krsna in Goloka Vrindavana.
So why then does Krsna allow the jiva-souls to have their independent freedom to even leave Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavan if they choose?
Devotee – "In the Srimad-Bhagavatam, it says that Krsna did not want us to come to this material world. If Krsna did not want us to come, why are we here? Why doesn’t He save me from thinking like that?"
Srila Prabhupada - "That means you lose your independence. That is force, in Bengali it is said, ‘If you catch one girl or boy, ‘You love me, you love me, you love me. Is it love? You love me, otherwise I will kill you! Is that love? So Krsna does not want to become a lover like that, on the point of revolver. ‘You love me, otherwise I shall kill you!’ That is not love; that is threatening. Love is reciprocal, voluntary, good exchange of feeling. Then there is love. Not by force; that is rape. Why one is called lover, another is called rape?" (July 8, 1976 in Washington, D.C)
First of all we read from above by Prabhupada, Krsna gives the jiva-souls "free will" in the spiritual worlds that allows them to make their own choices there.
Having free will also makes the jiva-souls fully responsible for all their choices and actions.
Rejecting Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavan and therefore having to enter the material creation, (but only less than 10% make such a choice) was a mistake by those jiva-souls because the material creation is NOT the real home of the individual jiva-souls.
For genuine love to exist, each jiva-soul must experience the free will to make their own choices, even if it means leaving Krsna if they choose, otherwise there can be no question of genuine love or service.
Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism - Critique of Descartes)
This quality or attribute of free will is part of the jiva-soul's marginal constitutional nature, as an independent free thinking part and parcels expansion of the Krsna.
Krsna allows this freedom that all jiva-souls have because without free will loving exchanges and reciprocation can NEVER exist.
Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence therefore you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God you have got independence, proportionately, therefore if he likes he can return. That independence has to be accepted, little independence. We CAN misuse that." (Mayapur, Feb 19, 1976)
Having "free will" is the constitutional make up of all marginal living entities (jiva-souls) that is ALWAYS part and parcel of their eternal character and personality in the spiritual worlds.
This means the jiva-souls can even choose to leave the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka-Vrindavana if they want.
Free will always allows this and if it didn't, then there is no question of loving exchanges or intimate relationships with Krsna.
This is why it is foolish that big, big sannyasis, gurus and Vaisnava scholars in some other sangas (religious cults), claim once entering the spiritual worlds the jiva-souls never again leave the spiritual world.
No, they CAN fall down again and again if they "choose" to do so! But only less than 10% again choose to fall down or leave, over 90% "choose" to stay.
As said above, such choices of fall down has nothing to do with Maya (material energy) because Maya does not exist on the Vaikuntha planets and in Goloka-Vrindavana.
It is simply the misuse of "free will" that is the cause of all fall down from the spiritual world.
The choice to leave Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana is possible because Krsna allows a "two-way" relationship that includes the jiva-souls having the choice and right to accept or reject Krsna if they choose.
Srila Prabhupada - "Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will. Unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will."
Hayagriva - "A man may know better but still act wrongly."
Srila Prabhupada -"Yes, but that is free will. He misuses his. Just like a thief, he knows that his stealing, it is bad, but still he does it. That is free will. He cannot check his greediness, so in spite of his knowing that he is doing wrong thing—he will be punished, he knows; he has seen another thief, he was punished, he was put into prison— everything he knows, but still he steals. Why? Misuse of free will. Unless there is misuse of free will, there is no question of free will." (Talk with Prabhupada - Rene Descartes)
Syamasundara - "But can we predict returning back home back to Godhead will be permanent? Can we predict that? Just like many prisoners leave the prison, however some do come back?"
Srila Prabhupada - "No, there is no permanent effect because we have got little independence. There is nothing permanent because you can misuse your independence at any time."
Syamasundara - "And some come back?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, otherwise there is no meaning of independence. Independence means you can do this, you can do that. "All right. Whatever you like."
Devotee - "Then he is so many times falling down, again and again, so will he eventually permanently come back?"
Srila Prabhupada - "He has got independence, therefore there is always the possibility he can misuse his independence, he CAN fall down. That's why when a man is released from the prison house, that does not mean permanently because he can come back again, the general law is NOT to come back, but if he likes, he can come back, otherwise what is the meaning of independence? Just like one becomes free from the prison house, naturally he should not go there again." (Talk with Syamasundara - Henri Bergson)
Even though Krsna has promised there is no return to the material creation once returning to the spiritual worlds.
The fact is, there IS return if the jiva-souls want to return to the land of exploration as Prabhupada explains here-
Acyutananda – "In Bhagavad Gita Krsna says, once coming to the spiritual world, the jiva-soul never returns to the material creation, so He can return?"
Srila Prabhupada – "If he likes he can return, that is voluntary."
Guru-kripa – "How is it that one can become envious of Krsna?"
Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence, you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God. God has got full independence, but you have got independence too, proportionately, because you are part and parcel, so if he likes, he can return. That independence has to be accepted. We can misuse that. Krsna-bahirmukha haïä bhoga väïchä kare. That misuse is the cause of our falldown." (Mayapur Feb 19, 1976)
Paramahamsa - "But ultimately if we come to Krsna, there’s no return to the material world?"
Srila Prabhupada - "There IS return to the material world, that is voluntary. Return there is."
Paramahamsa - "If we want."
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes."
Paramahamsa - "So we can come to the spiritual world and return?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes."
Paramahamsa - "Fall down?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, as soon as we try, “Oh, this material world is very nice, Yes, Krsna says, yes, you go and enjoy the material world, otherwise what is the meaning of free will?
Every living entity has got a little free will. And Krsna is so kind, He gives him opportunity, All right, you enjoy like this.
Just like some of our students sometimes go away, again come back. It is free will.
Just like one goes to the prisonhouse, not that government welcomes, "Come on. We have got prisonhouse. Come here, come here." He goes out of his free will; again comes out, again goes. Like that."
Paramahamsa - "So our desire to enjoy, we achieve these material bodies; and our desire to achieve Krsna brings us to our natural position."
Srila Prabhupada - '"Yes." (Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course, May 13, 1973, Los Angeles)
Devotee - "Well, I believe you once said that once a conditioned soul becomes perfected and gets out of the material world and he goes to Krsnaloka, there’s no possibility of falling back."
Srila Prabhupada - "No! There is possibility, but he does not come IF he is intelligent. Just like after putting your hand in the fire, you never put it in again. So those who are going back to Godhead, they MUST become intelligent. Why going back to Godhead?" (Talk with Syamasundara Dasa on philosophy)
Srila Prabhupada - "As soon as we try, "Oh, this material world is very nice, yes, Kṛṣṇa says, yes, you can go. Otherwise what is the meaning of free will? Every living entity has got a little free will. And Kṛṣṇa is so kind, He gives him opportunity, all right, you enjoy like this." It is free will." (Morning Walk Cheviot Hills May 13, 1973, Los Angeles)
All jiva-souls already have these 3 basic qualities.
1 - An independent sense of self worth, the ability of self-expression and the choice to voluntarily serve Krsna as they choose.
2 - Individuality, and a unique personality separate from Krsna's Personality.
3 - Their own unique character and identity separate from Krsna and all other jiva-souls too.
Only then can when these qualities exist can there be meaningful reciprocal loving exchanges between Krsna and His marginal living entities (jiva-souls)
It is a fact that sadly, some jiva-souls make wrong choices in the spiritual world Prabhupada has told us, giving the figure at less than 10%
This has nothing to do with Maya or material energy because Maya does not exist there but free will does.
Srila Prabhupada also explains that over 90% of jiva-souls choose to NEVER rebel or leave the spiritual worlds that would instantly transfers the less than 10% of rebellious jiva-souls to the temporary decaying material creation, where one is forced to accept the cycle of repeated birth and death.
Dr. John Mize – "Does Krsna know ahead of time that a soul is going to be foolish and fall?"
Srila Prabhupada – "Krsna? Yes, Krsna may know because He is omniscient."
Dr. John Mize – "Are more souls falling all the time?"
Srila Prabhupada – "Not all the time. But there is the tendency of fall down, not for all, but because there is independence… Everyone is not liking to misuse the independence. The same example-
Just like a government constructing a city and constructs also prison house because the government knows that somebody will be criminal. So their shelter must be also constructed. It is very easy to understand. Not that cent percent population will be criminal, but government knows that some of them will be.
Otherwise why they construct prison house also? One may say, “Where is the criminal? You are constructing…” Government knows, there will be criminal. So if the ordinary government can know, why God cannot know? Because there is tendency."
Dr. John Mize – "The origin of that tendency to fall from Goloka) is free will?"
Srila Prabhupada – "Yes."
Dr. John Mize – "From where does that tendency come?"
Srila Prabhupada – "Tendency means the independence. So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that you cannot become fall down, that is not independence. That is force. Therefore Krsna says,yathecchasi tathä kuru. “Now you do whatever you like." (BG, As It Is lecture, Mayapur, June 20, 1973)
While in the material creation, their actions, good and bad, come under the laws of material nature called karma, and they have to answer for all they do, good or bad.
Therefore, the full freedom or free will that exists in Goloka Vrindavana and Vaikuntha, certainly does NOT exist in the material creation.
Choosing to reject Krsna means the jiva-souls are FULLY responsible for their own actions.
Krsna is NOT responsible for the choices each jiva-soul makes, they are.
All the suffering the jiva-souls experience in the material creation is caused by them leaving Krsna in the spiritual world in the first place and then reaping the reactions of their own mistaken choices of actions within a temporary material bodily vessel or container within the material creation.
In other words, the jiva-soul is punished or rewarded for what ever actions, good or bad, they have "chosen" to act out in this life that may not be payed for until the next life, or even the life after that.
No one understands how Karma fully works because no one knows how many births we have had in the material creation over billions of years!!
This is important to understand and realize, we are all responsible for our own actions and pay for them with the kind of materialbody we get.
We CANNOT blame God (Krsna) for our suffering in the material worlds.
Without "free will" in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavan, freedom to uniquely serve and love Kṛṣṇa in one's own way from one's heart (personality) will NEVER exist.
This means the jiva-souls always have an independent sense of self worth, individuality, and their own unique character and personality separate from Krsna's Personality.
As said above, only then can reciprocal love between two exist with Krsna and His marginal living entity (jiva-soul) exist.
Srila Prabhupada has said without free will and the ability to reciprocate as an independent individual servant of Lord Krsna, then we are all no better than a dead stone.
Srila Prabhupāda – "Unless there are "two persons", where is the question of love? Love means two persons, then there is exchange, then there is love. I must deal with you open-hearted, you must deal with me open-hearted, then there is love. So if you want to love Kṛṣṇa, God, then these things must be there." (Aug 9, 1976, Tehran)
The individual jiva-souls (marginal living entities) can NEVER exist independently from Krsna, even though they CAN express their own independent free will that Krsna provides separately, for the purpose of allowing a "two-way" voluntary exchange of loving expressions that encourage unique individual contributions and personal offerings.
Swedish man - "Is there free will?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, just like you are sitting here. If you don’t like, you can go away. That’s your free will. There is free will, we are part and parcel of God, therefore we have got minute quantity of freedom." (Temple lecture Stockholm Sweden)
Srila Prabhupada - "Every individual soul is awarded a portion of independence because each is part and parcel of God. Thus he has the quality of independence, but in minute quantity. That is his individuality."
Syamasundara dasa - "Is Krsna within each atom as an individual entity different from every other entity?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, Krsna is there, He is individual. There are varieties of atoms, and sometimes they are combined together."
Syamasundara dasa - "How is each Krsna different? How is it He is an individual in each of the atoms?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Why is He not an individual? Krsna is always an individual. He is always a person, the Supreme Person, and He can expand Himself innumerably."
Syamasundara dasa - "And is Paramatma a person?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, every expansion is a person. We are all atomic expansions of Krsna, and we are all individual persons. Paramatma is another expansion, but that is a different kind of expansion."
Syamasundara dasa - "Is the jivatma, (the individual jiva-soul), also a person?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, if he were not a person, then how would you account for the differences? We are all different persons. You may agree with my opinion or not, but in any case you are an individual. Krsna is also an individual. Nityo nityanam. There are innumerable individual jiva-souls, but He is the supreme individual person."
Syamasundara dasa - "So even within material atoms, there is a spiritual life, a spiritual force?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, force means spiritual force."
Syamasundara dasa - "But even within the dead body there are forces. There is the force of decomposition."
Srila Prabhupada - "Krsna is within the atom, and the body is a combination of so many atoms; therefore the force for creating other living entities is also there even in the process of decomposition. When the individual soul's force is stopped within a particular body, we call that body a dead body. Still, Krsna's force is there because the body is a combination of atoms.
The ultimate desire is of Krsna. If you take it in that way, Krsna is within every atom, and therefore Krsna wants whatever is to be.
Therefore He wills that these two elements become one, and therefore the molecules combine to create water, or whatever. Thus there is a creation, and again there is another creation, and so on. In any case, the ultimate brain governing all creation is Krsna." (Dialectical Spiritualism: A Vedic View of Western Philosophy)
We must never forget that Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of ALL causes, if we properly understand this, then we will understand the following discussion that EVERYTHING comes from Krsna including free will.
Srila Prabhupada is simply confirming below that EVERYTHING comes from Krsna and MUST be sanctioned by Krsna first, including FREE WILL
Syamasundara dasa - "Does the individual soul have a little independence to choose?"
Srila Prabhupada - "No (not without the sanction of Krsna) Bhagavad-Gita states that when the individual soul wants to act, Krsna gives the orders. Man proposes, and God disposes."
Syamasundara dasa - "So we have no free will?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Not without the sanction of Krsna. Without Him, we cannot do anything. Therefore He is the ultimate cause."
Syamasundara dasa - "But I thought you have been saying that we have a little independence."
Srila Prabhupada - "We have the independence in the sense that we may deny or affirm, but unless Krsna sanctions, we cannot do anything." (Dialectical Spiritualism: A Vedic View of Western Philosophy)
Srila Prabhupada here is simply confirming EVERYTHING comes from Krsna and MUST be sanctioned by Krsna first, including FREE WILL because Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of ALL causes.
Nothing happens without the sanction of Krsna.
However, Krsna will ALWAYS sanction free will and the ability to choose, regardless of what is said above because without free will, the jiva-souls could never voluntary contribute in their own individual way to their relationship with Kṛṣṇa, which actually what makes it a "two-way" exchange.
Above, Srila Prabhupada in his discussion with Syamasundara dasa, is simply making the point that EVERYTHING is under the control of Krsna as the Bhagavad-gita teaches us-
"Not a blade of grass moves without the will of the Lord"
In other words, we only have free will because Krsna allows it, because He wants to experience diversity, personal contributions, and see self-expression from the jiva-souls, that all together allows them to "always" have a choice.
On the other hand, without free will the spiritual worlds would be impersonal, mindless and emotionally stagnant and cold like dead stone!
Srila Prabhupada - "If you have no free will, then you are a stone. The stone has no free will. You want to be stone? Then you must have free will!" (Aug 5, 1976, New Mayapur France)
All the individual personal contributions from the jiva-souls are forever expanding their unique ability of self expression in Vaikuntha and Goloka Vrindavana.
This allows them to always make voluntary offerings to Krsna that forever increase and expand loving emotions in healthy "two-way" exchanges between Kṛṣṇa and the individual jīva-souls.
It is VERY important to understand that the individual jiva-souls are "PERSONS" with their own personal unique individual attributes of self expression existing always in both Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana.
It must be clearly understood for love to truly exist, each jiva-soul MUST have their free will to make their own choices, even if it means leaving Krsna if they choose, otherwise there can be no question of genuine love or service.
Paramahaṁsa - "So we can come to the spiritual world and return?"
Prabhupāda -"Yes."
Paramahaṁsa - "Fall down?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, as soon as we try, Oh, this material world is very nice, Yes, Kṛṣṇa says, yes, you go. Otherwise what is the meaning of free will? Every living entity has got a little free will. And Kṛṣṇa is so kind, He gives him opportunity, "All right, you enjoy like this." It is free will." (Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course, May 13, 1973, Los Angeles)
Bali Mardana - "An example of free will is someone can choose Kṛṣṇa or turn away? Is that example of free will?"
Srila Prabhupāda - "Yes, because if you accept Kṛṣṇa, then you must follow what Kṛṣṇa says. If you don't follow Kṛṣṇa, then what is the use of talking of Kṛṣṇa?
Kṛṣṇa says, satataṁ kīrtayanto mām: (BG 9.14) "Always chanting about Me." That is mahātmā. Satataṁ kīrtayanto māṁ yatantaś ca dṛḍha-vratāḥ (BG 9.14). Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ: (BG 9.13)
"Mahātmā, those who are devotee, they are not under these material influence. If he accepts Kṛṣṇa, he must abide by the injunction of Kṛṣṇa." (Morning Walk, Jan 22, 1974, Hawaii)
Srila Prabhupada – "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that is not independence, that is force." (Los Angeles, June 23, 1975)
Cintamani (or the Cintamani Stone), is a wish-fulfilling jewel in Goloka Vrindavana.
Cintamani is ALWAYS aspired to achieve by great devotes because they ONLY desire to please Krsna.
To say you have no desires in Vaikuntha or Goloka-Vrindavana is impersonalism or Mayavadi nonsense!
One NEVER loses "desires" in the spiritual world because THOSE desires are forever expanding in ways to always please Krsna.
It is foolish to think one becomes desireless in the spiritual world, only impersonalist try to extinguish their desires and commit spiritual suicide.
Actually, devotees of Krsna are forever increasing their loving affection for the Lord in both Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana because they ALWAYS only desire to please Radha and Krsna in Vṛndāvana or Visnu and Lakshmi on the Vaikuntha planets unconditionally.^**^.
No comments:
Post a Comment
Note: Only a member of this blog may post a comment.