The individual spiritual bodily form of the eternal jiva-souls, have no beginning point, nor will they ever cease to be because there is neither birth or death for the individual jiva-souls.
Srila Prabhupada - "The spirit soul is NOT formless; it has got form, the spirit soul always has form and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. But with our material eyes at the present, our gross eyes, we cannot see these facts; therefore we foolishly believe the jiva-souls have no form." (Lecture BG, Ch 2 text 14, Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)
From that infinite form of the individual jiva-soul, all other forms are voluntary and possible, such as the four armed form on the Vaikuntha planets similar to Lord Visnu's Body. So, being an inactive "spark in the Brahmajyoti" is already a fallen condition. The original feature and full potential of the individual jiva-soul is an individual as bodily form like Krsna
Man is made in the image of God.
All individual jiva-souls eternally are a spiritual bodily form. Only while the individual jiva-souls are fallen, do they artificially appear as a formless impersonal spark, or bodiless individual spark in Krsna's effulgence (the impersonal brahmajyoti)
Krsna is behind everything, both the eternal individual jiva-souls in there unnatural bodiless impersonal conditioned state, and the jiva-souls as their nature personal position as an eternal active contributing servant as a bodily form.
Ultimately, we are individual PERSONS as an eternal spiritual bodily form in our full potential, and can ALWAYS choose to serve Krsna, or reject Him, otherwise free will has no meaning.
Those comments from past Sages and Acharyas who claim the individual jiva-souls never fall down from the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka-Vrindavana, may have been said this for many reasons, to give faith among aspiring devotees and neophytes, or to encourage them to understand that their natural constitutional position IS to NEVER ''choose'' to leave the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka-Vrindavana, and NEVER desire to be independent from Krsna or Visnu.
The eternal individual jiva-soul's original perpetual position is always voluntarily pleasing Krsna in a variety of ways with personal contributions.
Choosing to fall to the temporary material world, and then, due to the frustration of repeated birth and death, eventually falling further to the impersonal (inactive) brahmajyoti where the frustrated jiva-souls attempt to extinguish their individual identity, personality and existence (attempted spiritual suicide) and outwardly appear as a bodiless almost dead dormant spark in the impersonal Brahman or Brahmajyoti, denies the individual jiva-souls of who they really are as a PERSON in in their full potential as Krsna's dear friend in their natural eternal home of Goloka-Vrindavana, or voluntary servant of Viṣṇu in the Vaikuntha planet.
The individual jiva-soul's spiritual bodily appearance is eternally similar to Krsna's form, but we can voluntarily change that at ant time and be a flower, or a tree, or gopi, or cowherd boy, a chair Krsna sits on, or the grass Krsna walks on, or a cloud in the sky Krsna admires, the choices are unlimited.
The eternal individual jiva-souls in the spiritual world can "shape-shift" and be a flag pole on Krsna's chariot, or even Krsna's chariot, a blade of grass, a flower, a chair, a cloud in the sky etc, and at any moment change back to a two armed form in Goloka Vrindavana, or the four armed form on a Vaikuntha planets
No spiritual bodily form the individual jiva-souls can appear as, is fixed in the spiritual world, the individual jiva-soul's rasa (pastime) can constantly change their appearance over eternity.
It is all voluntary, you can be what ever you want to be if it is you genuine desire to please or amuse Krsna.
Srila Prabhupada - "In the spiritual world our relationship with Krsna or Visnu is voluntary. Some devotee wants to serve Krsna as flower; they become flower there. If I want to be a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna, he becomes flower, voluntarily, and he can change from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (SB Canto 6 Ch 1 text 1-4, Melb May 20, 1975)
In the spiritual world the choice of the individual jiva-soul's relationship with Krsna is voluntary from a blade of grass to a tree, a cow or gopi.
Their individual contributions are eternally expressed in both Vaikuntha and Goloka-Vrindavana in a "two-way' reciprocal exchange with Krsna in unlimited different ways and bodily forms over eternity.
Only the "eternal presence" of Krsna exists in the spiritual worlds, where as in the "material creation" time is divided into "past, present and future" which causes a progressive state of decay, decline, impermanence birth and death.
In the spiritual world the eternal individual jiva-souls are never forced to surrender to Krsna or do anything they choose not to do, everything there is voluntary.
Also, there is no best bodily form in the spiritual world because all are equally blissful and equal to each other.
From the two armed bodily form in Vrindavana to the four armed bodily form on the Vaikuntha planets, to being a cow, an ant, a bee, a cloud in the sky, a bench, a fence, etc etc. every aspect of the Spiritual worlds are alive with unlimited individuals, nothing material (dead) can exist there.
All eternal individual jiva-souls can be what ever form they desire or choose to please Krsna, or Visnu that are all equally blissful with the human form.
The human form is not higher or better than any other spiritual bodily form one may choice to be in the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka Vrindavana.
Just like in this material world some like carnation flowers while others prefer roses, it's an individual choice of what is best for you.
Even though everything is equally blissful in the spiritual world, there are five different relationships with Krsna, with each one gradually becoming more intimate than the previous one.
The eternal individual jiva-soul's original two armed spiritual body is always there as the basis, there can be a transformation of your original human looking spiritual body, into a spiritual bodily form you voluntarily choose.
From human form to a blade of grass, a cow, a horse, a chair, a cloud in the sky, a Peacock, a different type of human, a four armed form like Narayanas on a Vaikuntha planet, billions of different choices.
This is like a "shape-shifter," just like once you appeared as a baby but now as an adult, same person, different body.
A similar type of "shape-shifting" happens from childhood, to youth, to middle age, to old age - same person, different bodily appearance.
Devotee - "What is the form of the spiritual body, if the spirit soul is non-material, what is the form?"
Srila Prabhupāda - "There is form, just like this material body is compared with the dress. Now, just like in your present material form you have got hand; therefore your coat has got hand. You have got legs; therefore your pant has got legs. Therefore it is to be assumed that the spirit soul always has got form, and is expressed as hands, legs, heads, everything. The spirit soul is not formless; it has got form. But with our material eyes at the present, gross eyes, we cannot find it; therefore we say and foolishly believe it has no form." (Lecture BG 2.14, Mexico, Feb 14, 1975)
The full potential and original eternal feature of all marginal living entities (eternal individual jiva-souls) is a two-arm form like Krsna's Body.
Devotee – "Is the original body of the spirit soul a human form?"
Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, human form, God is also human form. "Man is made after the shape of God." I think there is in the Bible. Is it not? So God is also like human form. Here you see Krsna, two hands, two legs."
Hari-sauri dasa – "How do we understand, then, that there are peacocks and flowers and trees in the spiritual world? Are these not eternal forms?"
Srila Prabhupada – [describing material form first]: "Yes, they are more covered, just like if you cover your body with blanket, the hands and legs are invisible, but you are not the blanket. So the trees and plants, they are more covered. They are not in full manifestation. The human form is the full manifestation of the soul."
Hari-sauri dasa - "They are covered in the spiritual world?"
Srila Prabhupada - "Not in the spiritual world, there that is voluntary, some devotee wants to serve Krsna as flower; they become flower there. If I want to be a flower I shall lie down at the lotus feet of Krsna, he becomes flower, voluntarily, and he can change his, from flower to human body. That is spiritual life. There is no restriction. If some devotee wants to serve Krsna as cow, he serves Krsna as cow, as calf, as flower, as plant, as water, as ground, field, or as father, as mother, as friend, as beloved, anything. It is inconceivable, yet a fact." (SB, Canto 6 Ch 1 text 1-4, Melb, May 20, 1975)
Fortunately, over 90% of eternal individual jiva-souls choose to stay in the spiritual world's of the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka-Vrindavana, even though they can choose to leave if they want. However, almost 10% of individual jiva-souls do choose to leave the spiritual world and enter the material world via the dreams of Maha-Visnu.
Dr. John Mize – "Did all the jiva-souls that were in the spiritual sky (the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka Vrindavan) fall out of the spiritual sky at once or at different times, or are there any jiva-souls that are always good, they’re not foolish, they don’t fall down?"
Srila Prabhupada – "No, there are majority, 90%, they are always good. They never fall down."
Dr. John Mize – "So we’re among the 10%."
Srila Prabhupada – "Yes, or less than that. In the material, whole material world all the living entities they are… Just like in the prison house, there is some population, but they are not majority. The majority of the population, they are outside the prison house. Similarly, majority of living being, part and parcel of God, they are in the spiritual world. Only a few fall down." (BG, As It Is. lecture, Mayapur, June 20, 1973)
The eternal individual jiva-souls have free will so they can make their own choices and decisions, which includes even rejecting Krsna if they choose.
For free will to truly exist, the individual jiva-souls must have their unique freedom of expression, self determination and a variety of unique voluntary service.These qualities must ALWAYS be there if free will truly exists.
In the spiritual world the eternal individual jiva-soul's relationship with Krsna is always voluntary.
The jiva-soul's individual contributions are eternally expressed in both the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka-Vrindavana in a "two-way" reciprocal exchange of feelings with Krsna. The individual jiva-souls are never forced to surrender to Krsna or do anything they choose not to do, they are not Kṛṣṇa's puppets He manipulates when He pleases, they are His friends who voluntarily contribute to the relationship.
For loving voluntary service and exchanges to truly exist, the individual jiva-souls must be able to act on their free will and make their own contributions, choices, decisions and offerings, even if it also means rejecting Krsna, otherwise there can be no question of voluntary loving exchanges.
Each individual jiva-soul can voluntarily express themselves as an independent individual to experience unique loving exchanges and personal service.
Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)
This quality of free will is part and parcel of the individual jiva-soul's marginal constitution that allows them to be an independent free thinking expansion of the Krsna. Therefore, being marginal (separated) also means the individual jiva-souls always have free will included when describing the qualities of the marginal living entities (individual jiva-souls).
As said above, Krsna allows this freedom that the individual jiva-souls have because without free will, loving exchanges, personal offerings and a two-way reciprocal relationship could never exist.
Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence therefore you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God you have got independence, proportionately, therefore if he likes he can return to the material atmosphere. That independence has to be accepted, little independence. We can misuse that." (Mayapur, Feb 19, 1976)
The eternal individual jiva-souls have the free will to make their own choices which includes even rejecting Krsna, therefore in the spiritual world the jiva-soul's relationship with Krsna is always voluntary.
The jiva-soul's individual contributions are eternally expressed in both the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka-Vrindavana in "two-way" reciprocal exchange with Krsna, love can only exist in a "two-sided" exchange of emotions and feelings and can never exist with just "one" which is called impersonalism.
Srila Prabhupada - "Love means you take and you give also. Suppose if you love somebody and you simply take from him, but you don't give. Oh, do you think it is very good? No, it is not good, that is NOT love that is exploitation. If I go on simply taking from you, and if I don't offer you anything, that is simply exploitation." (BG, Ch 9 text 2-5, New York City, Nov 23, 1966)
Srila Prabhupada - "The impersonalist philosophy is oneness, so how there be love with just one? Is it possible? Have you got any such experience that love means one? No, love means two, there MUST be two." (SB, Canto 2 Ch 1 text 3, Paris, June 12, 1974)
Srila Prabhupada – "So everyone can know that independence (free will) means one can use it properly, or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that you cannot ever fall down, that is not independence. That is force."(Mayapur, June 20, 1973)
Free will only has meaning when the jiva-souls can express themselves in a two-sided relationship by contributing to the relationship's expansion of nectarine mellows.
Srila Prabhupāda - "Love means a relationship between "two persons," then there is exchange, then there is love. I must deal with you open-hearted, you must deal with me open-hearted, then there is love. So if you want to love Kṛṣṇa, God, then these things must be there." (Aug 9, 1976, Tehran)
In the spiritual world the individual jiva-souls are never forced to surrender to Krsna or do anything they choose not to do.
For loving service and exchanges to truly exist, the individual jiva-souls must be able to act on their free will and make their own choices, decisions and voluntary offerings or contributions, even if it means rejecting Krsna, otherwise there can be no question of genuine voluntary loving exchanges or having free will.
Each eternal individual jiva-soul can voluntarily express themselves as an independent (separated) person so they can experience unique loving exchanges in their chosen service.
Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)
This quality of free will is part and parcel of the eternal individual jiva-soul's marginal constitution that allows them to be an independent (separated) free thinking expansion of the Krsna, yet simultaneously always fully dependent on His energies (a paradox)
However, we must always understand that Krsna is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and cause of ALL causes and He is behind everything and not a blade of grass can move without His sanction.
Therefore, being marginal (separated) means the individual jiva-souls always have their free will when describing the qualities of the individual jiva-souls.
As said above, Krsna allows this freedom of self-expression the individual jiva-souls have because without free will, loving exchanges, personal offerings and a "two-way" reciprocal relationship could never exist.
Srila Prabhupada – "You have got little independence therefore you can violate. Because you are part and parcel of God you have got independence, proportionately, therefore if he likes he can return to the material atmosphere. That independence has to be accepted, little independence. We can misuse that." (Mayapur, Feb 19, 1976)
Having "free will" is the constitutional make up of all eternal individual marginal living entities (jiva-souls) that is eternally part and parcel of their individual character and personality in the spiritual world.
This means the individual jiva-souls can choose to leave the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka-Vrindavana if they choose, at anytime, it is incorrect to claim the eternal individual jiva-souls can never again fall down once on the Vaikuntha planets or Goloka-Vrindavana, that is their choose, not Kṛṣṇa's, otherwise free will has no meaning.
"Free will" ALWAYS allows the eternal individual jiva-souls to have a choice and voluntarily contribute to their relationship with Krsna, and without that ability to voluntarily choose, there is no question of free will or loving exchanges either.
Those Gurus, Swamis, yogis, scholars, academics and devotees who wrongly believe that once they enter the spiritual world, they never again can fall down, are often very sentimental and immature.
And yes, even Krsna's promise in Bhagavad Gita claiming the jiva-souls who return to the spiritual world, never fall down again can be rejected by those jiva-souls who AGAIN choose to enter the material world.
So, the choice to even leave Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrindavana is possible because Krsna allows a "two-way" relationship where one can also accept or reject Krsna if they choose, otherwise how can genuine love exist if there is no freedom?
Srila Prabhupada - "Free will means that you can act wrongly. That is free will, unless there is chance of doing wrong or right, there is no question of free will. Where is free will then? If I act only one sided, that means I have no free will. Because we act sometimes wrongly, that means free will."
Hayagriva dasa - "A man may know better but still act wrongly."
Srila Prabhupada - "Yes, but that is free will He misuses his. Just like a thief, he knows that his stealing is bad but still he does it. That is free will. He cannot check his greediness, so in spite of his knowing that he is doing wrong thing—he will be punished, he knows; he has seen another thief, he was punished, he was put into prison— everything he knows, but still he steals. Why? Misuse of free will. Unless there is misuse of free will, there is no question of free will." (Talk on the philosophy of Rene Descartes)
There is only one classification of eternal individual jiva-souls, not two as some believe. Therefore each individual jiva-soul has "two-sides" to their personality, they can either be "nitya-baddha" (eternally conditioned), or "nitya-siddha"(eternally liberated)
The term "eternally liberated or nitya-siddha" means only eternal while being nitya-siddha. However, the "nitya-siddhas" can fall from the position of eternally liberated (nitya-siddha) to enter eternally conditioned (nitya-baddha)
It means the position is eternal liberated (nitya-siddha) and eternally conditioned (nitya-baddha) are an eternal "post" and not the jiva-souls holding those positions. In this way the individual jiva-souls can choose for themselves to be with Krsna, or reject Krsna. This is because each jiva-soul, as part of their spiritual constitutional make-up, has free will.
Srila Prabhupada - "So, unless there is a possibility of misusing our free will, there is no question of freedom." (Dialectical Spiritualism, Critique of Descartes)
Srila Prabhupada – "So everyone can know that independence means one can use it properly, or one can misuse it. That is independence. If you make it one way only, that is not independence; that is force." (Los Angeles, June 23, 1975)
Some wrongly claim there are two types of jiva-souls-
1 - One jiva-soul stays in the Vaikuṇṭha planets and Goloka-Vṛndāvana and never has a choice to leave and go to the material world are called "nitya-siddha" or eternally liberated.
2 - And the other jiva-soul starts off in the material world and has never been to the spiritual world, they are called nitya-baddha or eternally conditioned, and can also be dormant (inactive) in the impersonal Brahmajyoti. However, they can also eventually enter the spiritual world too, but once there, can never fall down to the material world - so they claim.
The fact is, there is only ONE category of the individual jiva-souls who have "two-sides" to their individual identity and personality. The individual jiva-souls can be either nitya-siddha (eternally liberated) or nitya-baddha (eternally conditioned) and they both originate from Goloka Vrindavana or the Vaikuntha planets in the spiritual world. The natural position and home of all eternal jiva-souls is the spiritual world, and NOT the temporary material world, or the suicidal impersonal brahmajyoti.
Note: - eternally conditioned or eternally liberated only applies while one is in that position in the spiritual world (eternally liberated) or in the material world (eternally conditioned)
The individual jiva-soul's infinite position is nitya-siddha (eternally liberated) in the spiritual world. This means the jiva-soul's original perpetual home is the Vaikuntha planets and Goloka-Vrindavana.
Srila Prabhupada - "In the broader sense everyone comes from Krsnaloka (Goloka-Vrindavana). When one forgets Krsna he is conditioned (nitya-baddha), when one remembers Krsna he is liberated (nitya-siddha)." (Letter to Mukunda, June 10, 1969)
As said above, there is only one category of the eternal individual jiva-soul who can be either nitya-baddha (conditioned) or nitya-siddha (eternally)
To make it clear, only one kind of individual jiva-soul exists, and due to free will, they can choose to be either nitya-siddha (Krsna conscious) or nitya-baddha (conditioned).
The actual constitutional position of EVERY eternal individual marginal living entity (jiva-soul) is nitya-siddha.
Srila Prabhupada - "There are "two-kinds" of marginal living entities, one being nitya-siddha and the other is nitya-baddha. The actual constitutional position of every marginal living entity is nitya-siddha." (CC lecture, July 13, 1976)
Srila Prabhupada - "By following the rules and regulations and instructions of the spiritual master, he can become again nitya-siddha. So the Krsna consciousness movement is to make the nitya-baddhas (conditioned souls) AGAIN nitya-siddha (Krsna conscious)." (New York City Lecture CC, July 13, 1976)..÷..
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